Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Aeddon on Wed Mar 31, 2010 8:36 am

I think it'd be interesting if in our new codex we had different gear instead of special unit types. For example, something like a med-pack that our Justicar can take to give us FNP. Or some sort of relic that would turn a Brother-Captain into a de-facto chaplain. I think that this would be more in-line with our fluff and satisfy even our most puritan brothers.

I still think a GK Chaplain would be freakin' sweet though! Smile

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Brother Blutcher on Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:49 am

I like your "specialised gear" idea, Brother Aeddon.
Keeping GK squads structure would prevent looking too much like other SM Chapters...

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Constantine on Wed Mar 31, 2010 11:59 am

Brother Blutcher wrote:I like your "specialised gear" idea, Brother Aeddon.
Keeping GK squads structure would prevent looking too much like other SM Chapters...

This would be nice, but...................... I am seeing a trend in GW's codecies that is leaning towards the "good old days", when characters were like gods..... Mephiston is a prime exaple Twisted Evil This new trend could be good or bad, depending on your view point.

1) If indeed GW returns to having power house characters, which it seems like they are, then we will without a doubt recieve the same treatment when our codex is released......and as a result will loose some of our originality and slide closer to the fold of Space Marinedom pale

2) We will recieve some special lovin' (This is the option I am hoping for). The BA's have some great opportunities to build foces unique to their chapter (with the help of their Charactors) Dante's Angel wing for example...............If we were granted a unique formation due to a charactor then we could retain our individuality, AND remain competative.
-A BC/GM(Named Constantine Wink ) that could allow us to field Terminators as troop choices (KNIGHT WING!!!!!!) or something else equally cool like a BC/GM that allows us to take teleporting squads as troop choices would be what I was thinking.

What are your yhoughts on this?

BC

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+++"There is nothing in the arcane and blasphemous arsenal of the forces of Chaos that can compare to faith. With the power of faith, our weapons become shining instruments of deliverance that can cleave the mightiest daemon in twain. With the power of faith, our minds appear as slivers of pure agony to the daemon, driving into the wretched forms of those who would dare stand before us. With the power of faith, our words become commands that cause the daemon to cower and cringe in terror. I could meet my enemies unarmed without a shred of fear in my chest, for I know that the Emperor watches over me and guides my hand. So let them come. We shall show them what the power of faith can do."+++ (Brother Captain Stern)

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Aeddon on Wed Mar 31, 2010 1:17 pm

I like this idea, it also speaks to the versitility that our unique chapter must have in order to complete the missions we undertake.

Would having one or two "powerhouse" characters really be that bad of a thing? I can really see it being quite fluffy when it comes to the Grey Knights. The way I envision things we have a Grand Master and/or Brother-Captain who oversees all Grey Knight operations in a particular sector or group of sectors. These venerable warriors have fought for centuries if not millenium against the scions of the warp which breeds them into quite literally, the best that the Imperium could ever know next to the primarchs themselves! Should there not be a few of these that have the ability to stand toe-to-toe with any foe? I can imagine a Grand Master fighting a Greater Daemon in single combat as an epic battle rages all around them. Shouldn't this be possible in the tabletop?

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Constantine on Wed Mar 31, 2010 2:00 pm

I think that this is the way things will go.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Brother Blutcher on Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:12 pm

Hope so.... !!!!

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Snowfire on Wed Mar 31, 2010 8:18 pm

Wow, been a while since i last looked at this.

You guys have been pumping out some great ideas.

First off: Mkerr never got back to me with his ideas, so scratch that. But, I have managed to get my hands on a copy of Adobe Acrobat, so I can now knock out a PDF (just need to work out how to use it).

So as I have no job at the moment, it is a perfect time to really give this an overhaul and try and knock out a decent codex.

I need:

Fluff, lots of it. Break out your codex, your novels, anything that can provide history and battles and what not. GW have given us a opening here, we fight in the shadows, unknown to most of the Imperium, so we can pretty much create battles as we please.

Units: GK Chaplains, Heroes, Named Characters, Vehicles, the works. If you can justify its inclusion, and provide decent (not broken) rules, points value and stat line, I'll add it in, depending on peoples opinions. If you can also provide info about the unit, so it can be turned into a full page description that would be great.

Wargear: Is our current wargear up to standard? Can you think of better stuff? Name it, describe what it does, give it a points value, and I'll see if I can add it in.

Pictures: I am going to need pictures of painted models, and the black and white pictures used in the unit descriptions.

Now for the tough question: Do we make this a pure Grey Knights codex, or do we include Inquisitors and Assassins?

If anyone wants to put their hand up and volunteer to cover fluff or specific units, by all means please do.

Feel free to PM me with your ideas/suggestions/criticism.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by DarkRonin on Wed Mar 31, 2010 11:24 pm

Would it be over powered if we say that we drop True Grit and say, "All Grey Knights have trained extensively with both his Nemesis Force Weapon and his Storm Bolter. In the hands of a Grey Knight (Including Terminators), a Storm Bolter counts as a pistol (Additional close-combat weapon) in Close-Combat."

I see this as a way to make it seem that we ourselves are the cream of the crop. Sure our terminators already have an extra attack thanks to the armor, but compared to SM Terminators, we have the same numbers of attacks. From a fluff standpoint, I seriously think that they should have at least one more attack then SM Terminators.

The Additional weapon in close combat may seem crazy for the terminators, but I think that we should have it at least for our PAGK. Sure True Grit is nice and everything, but other models that have 2 weapons have the same benefit and more.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Snowfire on Thu Apr 01, 2010 1:46 am

Fast Attack - Jet Bikes? I know that that Raven Wing guy (can't remember his name) is on one of the Imperiums last jet bikes, but that doesn't mean that the GK don't have some stashed away.

50 points a model, without upgrades. This would make them equal to the Thunderwolf Cavalry of the Space Wolves.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Snowfire on Thu Apr 01, 2010 3:05 am

Ok, so I have been mucking around with Adobe for a little bit, and have the following:

http://www.mediafire.com/file/mzynnjmxztt/Codex Daemonhunters.pdf

Its only 6 pages long, and very little is in it at the moment, but I hope you get my drift?

All I need now is info and pictures.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Aeddon on Thu Apr 01, 2010 1:27 pm

I really...really want to contribute to this but I don't know. I'm currently involved in a codex write-up on another site and it's gone pretty out of control to this point.

@Snowfire,
I can try sending in some pictures of my models...maybe help in the think-tank a little but I cannot promise much aside from that at this point.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Snowfire on Thu Apr 01, 2010 3:42 pm

It's all good, any help is appreciated.

I'm guessing the codex your helping work on, on another site is now a case of, ohh the BA have these things, we need this sort of thing to beat them?

EDIT x2:

http://www.mediafire.com/?mnwmdmynmtm

18 Pages, mostly blank, but a few possible entries.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Andarius the Red on Sat May 01, 2010 5:22 pm

You know an interesting thought just came to me, what if you re-hashed psychic powers in the WH codex with DH? Banishment obviously doesn't work so why not have it replaced with some of the others in that codex.

Examples that come to mind are "His Will Be Done" or "Hammer of the Witches". They'd go well with our anti-psychic characteristics

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Carsten on Wed May 19, 2010 8:09 pm

Could Grey Knights w/ Jump Packs work from a practical point of view if all the members of the squad had swords like the Justicar?

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Aubec le noir on Thu May 20, 2010 8:50 am

yes ... there no special shape for the NFW : halberd, sword, hammer, mace ... are possible.
i have, btw, saved some different sword to make a special squad of "musketeers" only with swords ... but i can't find them in my personal mess called "the playing room" ! affraid Razz
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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by GMKDynamis on Sat Sep 18, 2010 11:52 am

If I may add brothers, I'd would like to see a codex with an armory that gives you the ability to purchase two NFWs for an extra attack, normal initiative and doubles your strength (S8, AP1) for anti-armor/vehicle capabilities.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by rogueuk on Sat Sep 18, 2010 6:35 pm

that would be nice i know someone who has a space marine with 2 powerfists which is legal some how

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Zealadin on Sat Sep 18, 2010 11:23 pm

Legal but super expensive!

I want storm bolters built into NFW's and THEN the option to buy a second NFW, which adds the second 2 strength, and provides a bonus attack, and makes the SB twin linked.
The AP1 thing might be a bit op.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Primarch on Sun Sep 19, 2010 1:39 am

rogueuk wrote:that would be nice i know someone who has a space marine with 2 powerfists which is legal some how

Marneus Calgar... lol Razz

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by rogueuk on Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:11 pm

Primarch wrote:
rogueuk wrote:that would be nice i know someone who has a space marine with 2 powerfists which is legal some how

Marneus Calgar... lol Razz

no its just a normal sergeant

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by bigbri on Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:00 pm

rogueuk wrote:
Primarch wrote:
rogueuk wrote:that would be nice i know someone who has a space marine with 2 powerfists which is legal some how

Marneus Calgar... lol Razz

no its just a normal sergeant

It's legit, since he can replace both his pistol and his bolter but it's insanely expensive

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Zealadin on Tue Sep 21, 2010 4:29 am

Its probably do-able depending on the ruling of the gear section. Blood ANgels have some opportunities like that, but sadly its literally double the cost :S

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Tombomb7 on Thu May 10, 2012 4:44 am

Zaithius wrote:I am in total agreement with you snow.

One thing I think they should change is our pt value. Our basic troops should not cost 25 pts per model unless they give us a 5 on initiative as opposed to a 4

One thing on this, it could make the Halbreds obsolete for many forces since I5 is well above average. With halbreds it would then be I7, not many players will see the need to take halbreds. Just something to think about I guess.

I too am with you brothers , although I've just started on the Grey knights. I was really REALLY hoping to get the chance to use storm trooper type marines in my army, alas they would only count as acolyte henchmen and they are not so good.


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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by bigbri on Thu May 10, 2012 9:23 am

@Tombomb7 I think you may have missed the dates on these posts. These are from when we played with the old codex:daemonhunters. Back then NFW's didn't have the +2I bonus. Also I5 isn't well above average. 4 is average 5 is slightly better and represent well trained individuals, plus back then I5 would have been fair. Regular PA GK were so horrendously overpriced for what they had.

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

Post by Tombomb7 on Fri May 11, 2012 12:41 pm

My bad brother bigbri.
I have indeed missed these posts. I would still like to vent my frustration at not having some sort of stormtrooper element to the army! I agree the knights were expensive in the older codex, and if the halbreds didn't have the +2 then I will retract my concerns Smile

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Re: Fixing Grey Knights and Sisters of Battle

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