Librarians?

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Pyriel on Sat Feb 09, 2013 7:47 pm

I think the libby codex powers are simply amazing. The 3:rd level of power is really not needed but instead of taking a chance of getting something decent by rolling 2 times on the rulebook tables with only one good power being a certainity (reroll shooting) I cant see why people would ever use the libby with two rulebook powers.

He is a total powerhouse when it comes to buffs, making squads I10, giving squads and himself +1S to +4S, protecting your already few miniatures by better cover saves and casting 12´bubbles of dangerous terrain is simply awesome. Things like a template that instant penns vehicles and makes low I enemies vanish just further makes for a wide variety of fun (and competitive) setups and play styles.

Plus as I already said, besides stealthed psyflemen dreads, summoning has won me more games then anything else if you tool your army a little bit and play smart.


What loadout do you use for the NDK?
I really love the NDK but struggle to make it into competitive gaming, it is as far as I see a really fun thing for fun gaming and the same goes for interceptors and purgators. Love those units but fail to see them as competitive.

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Re: Librarians?

Post by volvoe on Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:02 pm

My load out is usually: Teleporter, Incinerator, and Gatling Psilencer. I actually enjoy using a gatling psilencer on my NDK because it could wipe out an entire squad + Incinerator in one turn of shooting. But that's given I only play games against Xenos (friends). Sometimes I don't even use the teleporter and just put the NDK in reserves so he could DS to the Libby and lay down some shooting. It isn't optimal but getting first blood or just getting rid of infantry is good enough for me.

I usually run my libby with Mastery Level 2 as well. I don't think he needs to cast more than 2 a turn (more chance to perils). But the more I think about it It would be a good investment in larger games because you could use witchfire during overwatch. So giving yourself sanctuary + overwatch and then any buff incase they do get into close combat would be pretty good. I actually used warp rift as overwatch since it's a template weapon you roll a D3 instead of needing to roll 6's which is pretty good because they could fail their charge.

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Constantine on Sat Feb 09, 2013 9:24 pm

volvoe wrote:Well I like the logistics of it. Very Happy Thanks for providing the mathematics. Yeah, summoning a vehicle counts as if it has moved flat out. I should test summoning as well, but I'd rather use teleporters on NDK and use Interceptors. I use Mordrak and Libby, but never purchase summoning.

Do you have your Modrak list posted anywhere Brother?

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+++"There is nothing in the arcane and blasphemous arsenal of the forces of Chaos that can compare to faith. With the power of faith, our weapons become shining instruments of deliverance that can cleave the mightiest daemon in twain. With the power of faith, our minds appear as slivers of pure agony to the daemon, driving into the wretched forms of those who would dare stand before us. With the power of faith, our words become commands that cause the daemon to cower and cringe in terror. I could meet my enemies unarmed without a shred of fear in my chest, for I know that the Emperor watches over me and guides my hand. So let them come. We shall show them what the power of faith can do."+++ (Brother Captain Stern)

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Re: Librarians?

Post by volvoe on Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:15 pm

Constantine wrote: Do you have your Modrak list posted anywhere Brother?

Why yes I do. Very Happy http://greyknights.forumotion.com/t3475-semi-competitive-mordrak-2000-pts

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Constantine on Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:04 pm

volvoe wrote:
Constantine wrote: Do you have your Modrak list posted anywhere Brother?

Why yes I do. Very Happy http://greyknights.forumotion.com/t3475-semi-competitive-mordrak-2000-pts

Why thank you sir! Surprised

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+++"There is nothing in the arcane and blasphemous arsenal of the forces of Chaos that can compare to faith. With the power of faith, our weapons become shining instruments of deliverance that can cleave the mightiest daemon in twain. With the power of faith, our minds appear as slivers of pure agony to the daemon, driving into the wretched forms of those who would dare stand before us. With the power of faith, our words become commands that cause the daemon to cower and cringe in terror. I could meet my enemies unarmed without a shred of fear in my chest, for I know that the Emperor watches over me and guides my hand. So let them come. We shall show them what the power of faith can do."+++ (Brother Captain Stern)

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Pyriel on Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:16 am

My Mordrak list looks like this (as competitive as possible while being withing the fun category):


Librarian:
titan, sanctuary, shrouding, warp rift, summoning, homing beacon.

Mordrak
2 ghost knights - swords
2 ghost knights - hammers

NDK
Heavy incinerator

NDK
heavy incinerator

3X Psyfle dreads

10 strike squads
2 psycannon, psybolt

5 strike knights
psycannon

5 terminators
psycannon


1850 (if memory is correct)

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Constantine on Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:33 am

Cool list Brother Cool

That must be a cool force to see on the table. Do your NDKs have personal Teleporters? What is the play style for the list?

_________________
+++"There is nothing in the arcane and blasphemous arsenal of the forces of Chaos that can compare to faith. With the power of faith, our weapons become shining instruments of deliverance that can cleave the mightiest daemon in twain. With the power of faith, our minds appear as slivers of pure agony to the daemon, driving into the wretched forms of those who would dare stand before us. With the power of faith, our words become commands that cause the daemon to cower and cringe in terror. I could meet my enemies unarmed without a shred of fear in my chest, for I know that the Emperor watches over me and guides my hand. So let them come. We shall show them what the power of faith can do."+++ (Brother Captain Stern)

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Pyriel on Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:29 am

The force is just painted up in its entirely, all to the same standard as in the pics I posted in the gallery.


Last game I used this army was aaginst necrons.
They had something like:

Orb lord with 20 warriors

Destroyer lord with squad of destroyers/heavy destroyer

Lone full squad of destroyers/heavy destroyer

Squad of warriors

Squad of immortals

2 X walkers (dont remember the names, the big walkers that have a driver on top)

Plus other things




Migh be of here and there due to memory...
I used the libby and mordrak and his ghosts to drop in right next to the destroyer lord and his destroyer retinue.
3 dreads were at the back in ruins outside necron range but within range to everything.
A strike squad was at the back with the dreads (couldnt DE it due to the moronic reserve rules)
Rest was in reserve.

The libby and mordrak shot at the destroyer lord and all the destroyers, I cast warp rift over the whole squad as well as half the second destroyer squad behind them.
Dreads tried to take down the AV 13 shields on the spiders. One went down to 1hp, the other made all its cover saves.

A lot of destroyers were outright killed by warp rift but the destroyer lord made his I roll.


Nec turn:
Libby and mordrak gets shot and assaulted by the D lord and one walker. The rest of the army shuffles around not knowing where I will deepstrike, the 20 big squad of warriors with orb lord move towards mordrak and his squad.

2 ghost knights go down and mordrak looses 2 wounds, both wounds cause the ghosts to reappear.


GK turn.
Libby summons the small strike squad that stands useless at the back with the dreadnoughts.
Summoning puts them safe in a ruin with LOS and range only to the undamaged nec walker.

Both NDKs deepstrike, one close to the damaged walker, one into the libbies homing beacon so that the NDKs heavy incinerator has range to teh 20 warriors and lord that are approaching.

Melee sees both libby and mordrak reduced to 1W each and 2 ghost knights remain.
All the destroyers and Dlord are slain in return.

The small strike squad and the three dreads fail to damage the walker close to mordrak.

One NDK and his heavy incinerator severly decimates the 20 warriors.
The other NDK wipes out half a squad of immortals (close to the damaged walker).


Nec turn.

Not much happens, he fails to kill anything and inflicts a total of 2 wounds on the NDKs. The damaged walker sees no alternative then to assault one of my NDKs (or be assaulted the turn after) and the NDK kills it in melee.


GK turn:
Almost all necrons are tabled and opponent concedes and game ends.



Naturally depending on opposition, turn etc I use the army differently. It is fun and competitive but still fun to use and meet (not tournament competitive though).

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Constantine on Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:32 am

That does sound like a fun force to play.
Thanks fo rsharing that.

_________________
+++"There is nothing in the arcane and blasphemous arsenal of the forces of Chaos that can compare to faith. With the power of faith, our weapons become shining instruments of deliverance that can cleave the mightiest daemon in twain. With the power of faith, our minds appear as slivers of pure agony to the daemon, driving into the wretched forms of those who would dare stand before us. With the power of faith, our words become commands that cause the daemon to cower and cringe in terror. I could meet my enemies unarmed without a shred of fear in my chest, for I know that the Emperor watches over me and guides my hand. So let them come. We shall show them what the power of faith can do."+++ (Brother Captain Stern)

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Pyriel on Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:43 am

Know what, you just got me all fired up thinking it would be a nice idea to put this army up on my gaming table and take a pic of them all.

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Constantine on Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:49 am

Pyriel wrote:Know what, you just got me all fired up thinking it would be a nice idea to put this army up on my gaming table and take a pic of them all.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!! My plan has come to fruition!!! PICTURES!!!!!!!!!! cheers Razz

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+++"There is nothing in the arcane and blasphemous arsenal of the forces of Chaos that can compare to faith. With the power of faith, our weapons become shining instruments of deliverance that can cleave the mightiest daemon in twain. With the power of faith, our minds appear as slivers of pure agony to the daemon, driving into the wretched forms of those who would dare stand before us. With the power of faith, our words become commands that cause the daemon to cower and cringe in terror. I could meet my enemies unarmed without a shred of fear in my chest, for I know that the Emperor watches over me and guides my hand. So let them come. We shall show them what the power of faith can do."+++ (Brother Captain Stern)

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Klomster on Sun Feb 10, 2013 4:28 pm

You are most devious brother Constantine Razz

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Re: Librarians?

Post by volvoe on Sun Feb 10, 2013 5:24 pm

Wait a minute. I thought you're only allowed 3 Heavy Support slots how can you have 2 NDK and 3 Psyflemen dreads?! Shocked

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Pyriel on Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:08 pm

volvoe wrote:Wait a minute. I thought you're only allowed 3 Heavy Support slots how can you have 2 NDK and 3 Psyflemen dreads?! Shocked
Good catch. I was tired and screwed this one up completely.

I almost always use 3 psyfleman dreads so this got added in by sheer habit and thoughtfullness, sorry for that.

Naturally the list contained only one psyfle dread (and two NDKs).


BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!! My plan has come to fruition!!! PICTURES!!!!!!!!!!
Not today, it´s dark outside and thus bad light for picture taking. I´ll try to get time over tomorrow for some mordrak-army pics.

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Pyriel on Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:56 pm


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Re: Librarians?

Post by Constantine on Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:27 pm

Wohooooooo! cheers
Beautiful models brother!

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+++"There is nothing in the arcane and blasphemous arsenal of the forces of Chaos that can compare to faith. With the power of faith, our weapons become shining instruments of deliverance that can cleave the mightiest daemon in twain. With the power of faith, our minds appear as slivers of pure agony to the daemon, driving into the wretched forms of those who would dare stand before us. With the power of faith, our words become commands that cause the daemon to cower and cringe in terror. I could meet my enemies unarmed without a shred of fear in my chest, for I know that the Emperor watches over me and guides my hand. So let them come. We shall show them what the power of faith can do."+++ (Brother Captain Stern)

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Re: Librarians?

Post by DonFer on Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:27 am

You have one hell of a nice army there Brother. Really excellent work. Congrats!!

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Re: Librarians?

Post by SmokinBrown on Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:39 am

Back on the topic of librarians, does the teleport homer work with the summoning power? I don't have the book on me but from memory the homer rules say something along the lines of "note that the teleport homer only works for units arriving via teleportation", and the summoning rules say something like"remove from the tabletop and replace within 6" of the librarian using the DS rules". How do you guys play this out?

SB

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Constantine on Sat Mar 02, 2013 8:29 am

The general consensus that I have been reading is that the telport homer DOES NOT work with the summoning power. Sad

_________________
+++"There is nothing in the arcane and blasphemous arsenal of the forces of Chaos that can compare to faith. With the power of faith, our weapons become shining instruments of deliverance that can cleave the mightiest daemon in twain. With the power of faith, our minds appear as slivers of pure agony to the daemon, driving into the wretched forms of those who would dare stand before us. With the power of faith, our words become commands that cause the daemon to cower and cringe in terror. I could meet my enemies unarmed without a shred of fear in my chest, for I know that the Emperor watches over me and guides my hand. So let them come. We shall show them what the power of faith can do."+++ (Brother Captain Stern)

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Re: Librarians?

Post by jeffersonian000 on Sat Mar 02, 2013 2:37 pm

While the general consensus is that Teleport Homers do not work with The Summoning, there is enough evidence to support its use. The Summoning is a form of teleportation, as it is a method of transporting a unit via the warp from one point on the battlefield to another, the very definition of Teleportation. The reasoning behind disallowing Teleport Homers from being used with The Summoning is that nowhere in The Summoning's text does it state that the power is a "teleportation". Personally, I believe the tactic is legal, since GW did not provide "teleportation" as a specifically defined keyword, yet has described the process of teleportation in a number of passages with the same wording as The Summoning. Also, Summoned units that mishap and go into reserves will arrive on a following turn via Deep Strike exactly as if the unit had been placed in reserves to begin with, which implies teleportation any way. If the Summoned unit can arrive via teleportation if a mishap occurs, then why aren’t hey arriving via teleportation when a mishap doesn’t occur?

However, in the end, the general consensus is that the two do not work with each other for no reason other than GW's failure to point out that the two should, or shouldn't, as the case may be.

SJ

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Constantine on Sat Mar 02, 2013 3:04 pm

Let me start by saying that I am with you in regards to GW needing to get their act together when it comes to wording and rules Rolling Eyes .

However,

I think of teleporting and summoning as different. Kind of like taking the stairs or the elevator, they have the same end result but the process is different.

It doesn't matter if I push the button in the elevator for the 13th floor and then take the stairs, I still have to use the stairs and their signage.
But if I am taking the elevator and push the button for the thirteenth floor (AKA The Teleport Homer) it will help.

If I confused things more I appologize, I am just trying to clarify my point....I think..... scratch Razz

_________________
+++"There is nothing in the arcane and blasphemous arsenal of the forces of Chaos that can compare to faith. With the power of faith, our weapons become shining instruments of deliverance that can cleave the mightiest daemon in twain. With the power of faith, our minds appear as slivers of pure agony to the daemon, driving into the wretched forms of those who would dare stand before us. With the power of faith, our words become commands that cause the daemon to cower and cringe in terror. I could meet my enemies unarmed without a shred of fear in my chest, for I know that the Emperor watches over me and guides my hand. So let them come. We shall show them what the power of faith can do."+++ (Brother Captain Stern)

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Re: Librarians?

Post by Vecuu on Sat Mar 02, 2013 5:24 pm

I don't think it's possibly to rectify the ambiguity of the Teleport Homer and Summoning issue.

As a general rule of thumb, it's always best to err on the side of what's better for your opponent in these situations. After all, what would you prefer? Play it how you want only to be FAQ'd that you were cheating, or play it the safe way and learn through an FAQ that you now have a new and cool strategy? I prefer the second.

At the end of the day, the ruling is at the mercy of what your opponents agree with and allow, or, perhaps more importantly, what your local T.O. thinks.

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Re: Librarians?

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