New GK 1000 pts army, suggestions please!

Hail, brothers.

This is my first post on these forums, and I seek advice on a new army of Grey Knights. I have previously used a few terminators, a hero and a TPAGK squad as reinforcements for my ultramarines army, and since I just finnished a rather large force of necrons, I've decided to expand my group of Rusty (due to my colour scheme, in which I use Tin Bitz and Brazen Brass instead of the more common silvery variants) Knights into an army of its own.

Since the holy Emperor of Mankind have blessed me with more funds for war (yay christmas! ) I have decided to put my plan in motion. I wish for my army to focus purely on Grey Knights and their vehicles, partly because it looks friggin' awesome on the tabletop, and partly because of the challenge. And since I've played Necrons and Space Marines before, I am somewhat used to a "quality before quantity" style of play. Below I will post my available models, as well as an idea of an army, after which I hope some friendly souls will help me either by improving my own list, or suggesting other setups.

So, with that said, here it goes. Below is the models I have, divided into their categories on the force organisation chart. Non-Grey Knight units are marked with (NGK) and, if you do not truly think they would be a better choice than a GK unit.

HQ Choices
Brother-Captain Stern - Can be used as either a normal brother-captain, or Grand Master, as well.
Inquisitor Lord (NGK) - See Inquisitor. Henchmen can be built form scratch using spare models and bits.

Elites
5 Grey Knight Terminators - One Brother-Captain and one carrying an Incinerator.
Inquisitor (NGK) - I do not currently have an Inquisitor, but I do have enough Space Marine bits and Green Stuff to make one with about any wargear I'd want.
Vindicare Assassin (NGK)

Troops
20 Grey Knights in Power Armor - Two Justicars, two carrying Psycannons and two carrying Incinerators. Two of the NFW-wielding knights have been built in a way so that they can be distinguished and used as Justicars, should one want to split the knights into three or four squads instead.
12 (Ksarkin) Inquisitorial Stormtroopers (NGK) - One Veteran, two carrying flamers and two carrying grenade launchers.

Fast Attack
20 Teleport PAGK's - Same as in the troops section, should one wish to teleport a small squad or two into battle.

Heavy Support
Land Raider - Painted with an Ultramarines colour scheme, although this doesn't matter, since my Knights and Marines have fought together long enough to grant each other such favours.
Dreadnought - Armed with a twin-linked lascannon as well as a missile launcher. From my early days, when I was young and dumb, during which I glued my weapons to the 'nought instead of making it possible to swap them for other weapons.

Dedicated transports
9 Rhinos - Ultramarines Colour Scheme, but can be included in the same manner as the Land Raider
Land Raider - The same as under Heavy Support, as which it should be taken since it renders it able to carry any unit.

Well then, there you have it. Some of these are models previously bought, and some are models I've bought for christmas money. I do have the possibility to purchase further models, although I want to avoid this as much as possible. Still, a grand master/brother-captain and another terminator with a Psycannon would be juicy!

So, that's the models I have. Now for an army.

-HQ-

Brother-Captain and retinue of four Terminators, of which one is carrying an incinerator - 260 pts.

-Troops-

Justicar w. Targeter & Melta Bombs and 4 NFW-armed Knights, as well as one Incinerator-armed Knight - 191 pts.
Justicar w. Targeter & melta Bombs and 4 NFW-armed Knights, as well as one Incinerator-armed Knight - 191 pts.
Justicar w. Targeter and 2 NFW-armed Knights, as well as two Psycannon-armed Knights - 201 pts.

-Heavy Support-

Dreadnought w. Twin-Linked Lascannon and Missile Launcher - 140 pts.

This leaves 15 points to upgrade the terminators Incinerator to a Psycannon, or to spend on other wargear.

An alternative could be to remove both Incinerator-armed Knights and the Dreadnought, as well as the Terminator Incinerator, and instead add the Land Raider to the setup, which would allow me to shove my terminators up where I need them. After performing these changes, the list ends up at 1008 points. So, since I've grabbed the anti-tank capabilities of the Land Raider, I drop the Melta Bombs as the NFWs' and Psycannons' will handle anything with an armor rating up to 12. The last two points is then used to give frag grenades to two of my Justicars. If all these changes would be made, the list would look somewhat like this;

-HQ-

Brother-Captain and retinue of four Terminators - 245 pts.

-Troops-

Justicar w. Targeter & Frag Grenades and 4 NFW-armed Knights - 151 pts.
Justicar w. Targeter & Frag Grenades and 4 NFW-armed Knights - 151 pts.
Justicar w. Targeter and 2 NFW-armed Knights, as well as two Psycannon-armed Knights - 201 pts.

-Heavy Support-

Land Raider - 250 pts.

-Total-
1000 pts.

And there you have them! now I want both suggestions on changes, as well as other armies I can use. I tried to build these two in a rather balanced manner, with both anti-infantry capabilities at range and in close-combat as well as some anti-vehicle capabilities. If you happen to come up with an army more specialized, feel free to post it, since variation's always fun!

In the future, I'll probably be asking for suggestions on a 1500 pts army as well, so feel free to add "expansion blocks" to your own ideas which kicks the army up a notch!

With that said, hello again. I hope I won't be of too much trouble for y'all!

PS. Crap, I'm such a sucker when it comes to writing at forums... I've managed to pull together yet another mile-long post!

Welcome to the forum!
What I suggest at 1000 points is to either drop the terminator retinue and reinforce the knight squads or drop one of the knight squads and reinforce the others.

I agree.....

Grimhack wrote:Welcome to the forum!
What I suggest at 1000 points is to either drop the terminator retinue and reinforce the knight squads or drop one of the knight squads and reinforce the others.

I see your point, albeit I have had some great experiences with my terminators in the past. Downing Abbadon in one round, as an example. His weapon did rebel, ofcourse, but then again: GK 1 - CSM 0!

So, should I go for a brother-captain with an Incinerator, to add to a squad going in my Land raider instead, giving me a surgical cc spearhead?

-HQ-

Brother-Captain w. Incinerator - 81

-Troops-

Justicar w. Targeter, Melta Bombs & Frag Grenades and 7 NFW-armed Knights - 232 pts.
Justicar w. Targeter, Melta Bombs & Frag Grenades and 7 NFW-armed Knights - 232 pts.
Justicar w. Targeter and 2 NFW-armed Knights, as well as two Psycannon-armed Knights - 201 pts.

-Heavy Support-

Land Raider w. Smoke Launchers & Searchlight - 254 pts.

-Total-
1000 pts.

Note - The searchlight was just placed there to get the army up to 1000 pts, since I didn't have any other 1-point alternatives left.

Should the mission I'll play be one in which the need of scoring units is absent (A custom such or Annihilation) I could always nudge one of my PAGK squads into the Fast Attack section and teleport them into the fray.

More comments people!

Edit - Just noticed my build would require me to purchase three more Knights with NFWs' BAH! Sacrifices has to be made in battling the foul pawns of chaos! FOR THE EMPEROR!

Sorry for double-posting, but since I've already added to my previous post, and it being as long as it currently is, I felt it would be better to add this idea in a whole new post!

Got another idea, although the sleepiness might be getting to my head atm. Here's a combination I don't think ANYONE would expect in a 1000 pts game. While I've diverted slightly from my previous "pure GK army" idea, it's worth it just for the EXTREME laughters I'll probably experience with such an combination. What's you're opinion on THIS;

-HQ-

Brother-Captain - 61 pts.

-Troops-

Justicar w. Targeter & Frag Grenades and 4 NFW-armed Knights, as well as an Incinerator-armed Knight - 187 pts.
Justicar w. Targeter and 4 NFW-armed Knights, as well as an Incinerator-armed Knight - 186 pts.
5 Inquisitorial Stormtroopers - 50 pts.

-Heavy Support-

Land Raider w. Smoke Launchers & Extra Armor - 258 pts.
Land raider Crusader w. Smoke Launchers - 258 pts.

-Total-
1000 pts.

The Inquisitorial Stormtroopers will hang around my objective, should I have one, while my LR and LRC delivers my knights to the enemy while pounding them with lascannon and bolter. The Stormtroopers would ideally hide in cover until my LR have delivered its share of knights (My B-C being in the Crusader with the others), after which it would cruise back to them, and allow them to embark. After that, my LR would remain stationary and pummel what vehicles the enemy might have, until the last turn on which my troopers disembark and claims my objective. When this is done, ideally my knights will at least contest the enemies objective, or, should the dice be on my side, my hurricane bolters and incinerators will have turned them into perforated ashes (Bolt-holes as well as incine----... You get it ). It is a little weak in numbers, I admit, but heck... how many players field enough equipment to bring down a landraider, or even two? 'Evil laughter'

C'mon, opinions opinions opinions!

It's not that strange of a list, your last one. If you read 'way of the water warrior' on bolter and chainsword, the guy who wrote it is really happy to field 2 raiders, a brother captain and 2 squads of knights in a 1000 points battle. You just didn't take a psycannon on the brother captain and took a bit less knights to get the stormtroopers in.

Be wary !!!!
Storm trooper have a sad tendence to die, when under heavy fire. I recently fielded two 10 men squads, and all of them were killed by those evil eldars...

The life of a stormtrooper may be cheap, but watch your opponent tremble in fear when he notices he just placed a raider next to the rhino containing 2 troopers with meltaguns

That's right! Protect them under cover, or cast them with a rhino and let the vetrans teleport homer do its job...

I've read up on the Way of the Water Warrior, and heck, this sounds awesome! While it was fun to change the way my Ultramarines fought from time to time, doing the same with my Necrons was rather hard. Most of the time, it was Phalanx or a bloody mess.

So, this will undoubtedly be something I'll enjoy. Thus, I'll pretty much stick to the list he's using, since it seems to work well with the strategy. And I've already laid out the structure for the 1500 pts. version, which I recently posted in another thread. I'll just copy it here;

HQ
- Grand Master (145)

Troops
- PAGK Fire-Support Squad: (202)
Justicar with Auspex & Targeter (52)
4x PAGK with 2x Psycannons (150)

- PAGK Assault Squad: (237)
Justicar "Augustus" with Frag Grenades & Targeter (52)
7x PAGK with 1x Incinerators (185)

- PAGK Assault Squad: (237)
Justicar "Whatshisnameius" with Frag Grenades & Targeter (52)
7x PAGK with 1x Incinerators (185)

- IST Squad: (158)
8 Inquisitorial Stormtroopers w. 2 Meltaguns (100)
Mounted in a Rhino with Extra Armour and Smoke Launchers (58)

Heavy Support: (520)
Land Rider with Dozer Blades and Extra Armour (260)
Land Rider with Dozer Blades and Extra Armour (260)

-Total: (1500)

There we go. What do you think? :>

Edit: Finally edited the list!

Lol, justicar what's his name -ius.
anyway, I personally don't like smoke launchers on landraiders but it's probably a personal thing. I'd rather shoot my possible threat and face the consequences instead of popping smoke and not shooting at all. For the rest I'd also change the flamer with the stormtroopers for another meltagun.
And I'm not sure on the frag grenades of your fire support squad, if they get close to combat it's probably over for them so grenades won't really help them much.

Why 2 raiders? with the ponts of 1 you could get a termies retinue for your Grand Master...

True, the smoke launchers probably won't be used at all. With 14 in armour rating, I'd rather place myself behidn a medium-sized ruin and blast away my godhammers. Think I forgot the fact that it's either shoot or smoke, not both. >.<

And the frag grenades on the support squad was merely a filler, since I had a single point and nothing to spend it on. And aye, another melta would be neat. So, I'll just remove the launchers on my raiders, and use 5 of the 6 points to upgrade the flamer to a melta, even though that means I need to get -two- new Kasrkin Meltagun Models, doh! But it's still worth it.

I'll edit the list now.

Well, the kasrkin melta models come with kasrkin plasma models... And they aren't bad either!
@ blutcher: The point for the two raiders (in my opinion) is to provide a rock solid antitank gun platform and more mobility. The inability of taking rhinos really gives us no other choice I guess.

I understand, but its expensive, and GK can't stand much models....
But the perspective to field 2 raiders is very impressive!

Fielding 3 raiders at 1500 makes some eyebrows raise and then makes sweat break out as they think how to deal with it...
Although it is just as possible that your opponent will just laugh and blow them up in turn 1 if you're unlucky and not careful.

Two raiders, simply because of the force with which I can strike, for the endurance with which I can survive, and for the speed with which I can move. Surely you mujst agree, that a Land Raider is awesome? Wouldn 't two raiders be DOUBLE AWESOME? Not only are they resilient, they can destroy enemy armour while transporting my assault squads to the enemy objective. There, they can drop them of, and while my troopers launch their assault, they can actually place themselves between myself and the enemy, acting like cover and LOS-breaker should my assault troops repel their designated foe. Did I mention that four Godhammers are better than two?

Imagine this scenario: Your enemy is advancing his close-combat troops towards your line, mounted in transports. Half a foot behind them, his enemy is packing several plasma cannons that will literally melt your troops into nothing should you move them any closer. Now, you have your Godhammers. With your assault squads mounted in the raiders, you have two choices. Either bombard the transports and drive past them to the heavy weapons squads. Or, you do as you can with several Land Raiders; You rush them around the flanks of the transports, and turn them so that the stand in a position like this (The minor sketch shows them with the PAGKs disembarked, which they will do after the LR is proper placed, ofcourse);

[HW] [HW]

... / L /\ L \ With the access ramps swiveled
.. / R /..\ R \ towards the transports, ofcourse
... (GK)(GK)
.. [T][T][T]

Now, in the shooting phase, your Godhammers, as well as your psycannon squad, blast away. They focus upon one of the transports, until one is wrecked. When this is done, the knights go in for the kill during the assault phase.

The V-tactic. It is not possible to utilize it with a single Land Raider, and smaller vehicles are both too weak and too small.

I plan to use this in adaption to "The Way of the Water Warrior" to which my eyes have been opened. A force able to adapt and counter any strategy used by the enemy, even when outnumbered. It'll be quite some change from my previous Necron force. Phalanx, or another variant of the Phalanx. Or hey, why don't you build your force around the Phalanx strategy?

But anyway, there you have the answer. Resilient transports with anti-vehicle capabilities I'd otherwise be lacking.

@ Grimhack
Indeed, Plasma guns doesn't sound bad either! Might come in handy if I know I'll be facing infantry-heavy enemies, since it's a simple swap of models at the same values. :Cheers:

EDIT;
Three Raiders would be overkill, not the least for my wallet! But it would truly be interesting to see the enemy react to it!

Three Raiders would be overkill, not the least for my wallet! But it would truly be interesting to see the enemy react to it!

of course but I have never played apocalypse...

three raiders wasn't apocalypse

really overkills....

It was killpoints against eldar, 2 godhammers and a crusader. I didn't loose a single killpoint but took like 9 but had quite some luck.