Shocking day of gaming

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Shocking day of gaming

Post by Valten on Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:15 am

WARNING LONG POST!!!

I spent last Saturday in my local GW. The afternoon event was to be a mini doubles tournament with each partner taking 500 points, 1 HQ and at least 1 troops, no SC. I thought that it would be a good time to try out part of my 750 list which is taking part in a doubles tournament at the same store from this Thursday.

I started off the day with a 1000 points game VS Orks. I took pretty much everything I had with me (I don't actually have that much at the moment), and still had to borrow a Dreadnought from the store. My 1000 points lined up like this:

OX =][=, Rad and Psychotroke Grenades, 5 man Purifier Squad (1 hammer, 1 Psycannon, 3 Halberds), 1 Eversor Assassin (I wanted to take a Vindicare but don't have the model), 5 man Strike Squad (Hammer, Psycannon), Terminator Squad (Psycannon, Hammer, Halberds) and 2 Dreadnoughts with Assault Cannons and Psybolt Ammo.

He had something like: Big Mek with Force Field in Battlewagon, Nobs, 2 x 30 Boyz and Shootaz.

We rolled two objectives. I placed mine towards the middle of the field, whereas he placed his in his deployment on the 3rd floor of a building where he also deployed one of his 30 man Sluggaz!!!

I managed to steal the initiative and proceeded to wreck his battlewagon using one of the Dreadnoughts. I also thinned out one of his boyz squads. He moved everything forward.

I proceeded to next kill 3 Lootaz, who failed their leadership test and ran off the board!(Woop!) and took his ground floor boyz to just 3 models in a hail of stormbolter and Psycannon fire. He ran these boys into my Purifiers, and then realised my =][= was in that squad with Psychotroke grenades. I rolled a 6, and two of the three models failed their initiative test, meaning they would strike their own unit. At least they would have done if the halberds in the Purifier squad hadn't killed them off. He managed to also get his Nobz into combat with one of my Dreadnoughts and proceeded to blow it up.

Next turn I retaliated by killing off the Big Mek with the other Dreadnought and assaulting the Nobz with both my Purifiers and Terminators. I rolled a 2 on the Psychotroke grenades, which meant that I hit automatically. Needless to say that after activating my force weapons there were no Nobz left. All that was left was his last 30 Slugga Boyz sat on his objective. He didn't do anything that turn.

For the next two turns I moved everything except my Strike Squad (who sat on my objective) into shooting range and blasted the Orks... who went to ground two turns running. The game ended turn 5 with him having just 3 Orks left on his objective and leaving the game a draw!!!!!!

In another game I had a 500 point battle against Eldar - we wanted to test out our forces for the afternoon. I had my =][=, Strike Squad, Terminator Squad, and 1 Dreadnought. He had a Farseer, Dire Avenger Squad, D-Cannon platform and Harlequin squad.

The game started badly as he just sat there and waited for me to get to him. I'm beginning to realise that having everything with a 24" range is really really bad. I couldn't see anything except his D-Cannon which was in cover and his Harlequin squad which the Farseer kept using Veil of Tears on (roll 2D6 and double it - that is how far you can see the unit for shooting). Eventually I managed to take down the D-Cannon, and he moved his Dire Avengers, which I also managed to shoot down. However, He assaulted my Terminators with his Harlequins (which ignore cover....) and took them down easily enough - I'm not very good at rolling 5+ when I need to. Over the course of the next two turns he managed to table me... Sad

Not a good start to the day.

In the afternoon tournament I was partnered up with a Blood Angel player, taking a Captain with Jump Pack, Power Weapon and Melta Bombs, an Assault Squad, and a Terminator Assault Squad (Lightening Claws).

First game we played Eldar (guy from the morning) and another Blood Angel. The other Blood Angel had a Captain with Power Sword, some Death Company and a BAAL. The BAAL scouted, then proceeded to take out half of my Strike Squad. I managed to get the BAAL back with a Crew Stunned result, and destroyed the D-Cannon with my Terminators. Our Assault Squad destroyed the BAAL before being wiped out by those damned Harlequins. The Death Company assaulted the Assault Terminators, and the Death Company lost. The Assault Terminators assaulted into cover against the Dire Avengers, not realising the enemy Captain was there also. Their captain wiped out the assault terminators, and the Harlequins repeated their feats from the morning by tabling me...

Second game was Orks (guy from the morning) and Eldar again... Eldar took a Fire Prism, Farseer, Dire Avengers and Pathfinders. Once again we were out ranged, with my Dreadnought losing its' Assault Cannon from the Fire Prism first turn. I managed to destroy the main weapon of the fire prism, but my BA team mate got wiped out by the Ork Warboss and his Nobz and 30 boys who all went into the same combat. I managed to destroy the Orks with the Terminators and Dreadnought, but the game ended up a draw, with us both having an objective each. Victory points ensured that we lost that game too.

So we ended up bottom in the tournament. Not a great start to my Grey Knight career.

Now I'm not normally a fan of putting our Grey Knights in metal boxes (Rhinos, Razers) because it just doesn't match the fluff. But after Saturday I think I'm going to have to re-tweak my 'purchase plan' for my 1500 point force. I also think that if I had taken a Librarian instead of an =][=, I would have been able to sway the outcome a little due to having a Psychic hood.

With the 750 doubles coming up, I ask this question - what would be better? An =][= with Psychotoke and Rad Grenades and Power Weapon, with a Dreadnought (assault cannon and psybolt ammo), or a Librarian?

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by Zealadin on Mon Jun 27, 2011 5:25 am

I don't think an Inq with rad grenades and a PW is really ever worth taking except as an extremely cheap choice to take with say a squad of purifiers or DCA in an assault vehicle. Even in this situation I think a BrotherChamp is better for the rerolls on charge.
Plus a Lib can do similar with MoT which also helps immensely against dreads and vehicles.

You also need to keep in mind that you don't always want to get into assault with some enemy units, Harlies are dangerous because of veil of tears and rending. Bad rend rolls and they won't do much, not getting the charge and S3 is more funny than dangerous. Their threat range is 18" MAX if they get a 6 for fleet. You just need to try and maintain a little distance, or feed them something to get your own charge off or get close to shoot them. If you can flamer them you'll be laughing. Also run a dread into them. They will struggle even with rends. Then you can assault into the combat. You can indirect fire them with templates or blasts as well.
Combat orientated units should also have halberds so they hit at the same time as Harlies which should do a bit of damage.

Your also going to have major issues with 5 man squads. If you play MSU style then yes they work, but yes they also need transports, and your army works by using say 3-4 of these MSU's to gang up on and take out an opponents squad.
5 man GKT units can work, although I've found even they are somewhat lacking once they get into combat due to limited attacks and WS4.
I think 10 is the real lucky number for GK units.
Two reasons, PsyAmmo is far more reasonably priced this way, heavy weapons are more easily stacked, and combat squads can be split into heavy weapon specialists and combat specialists, or into seperate roles.

A librarian can also have a major effect in several ways. You can sanctuary a squad that is going to be charged and maybe destroy your opponents charge, plus you have shrouding and a few other nifty abilities.

At 500 points I think it will be difficult to get GK to shine unless you go inquisition themed, you just can't get much on the table.

I would also recommend trying a dreadnought with two TL AutoCannons and Psybolt Ammo, it is by far one of the best value for money choices you can take in the codex.
It can't rend, but will do very nasty things to your opponents vehicles, and despite the low AP value it still has the ability to instant kill many enemy units with S8.

So at 1000 points you really need to decide whether your army will have 5 man squads all in vehicles, or 10 man squads with the choice of vehicles.

Sounds like a good day of gaming though, don't be dissapointed with the results, it can be hard starting out with small model count armies, or with fragile armies.
The Rhino and Razorback with a PsyHB are both good too.

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by Coyote on Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:54 am

I'm not really about tailoring your army to beat specific builds, but I have a friend who always used his Harlies against my GK back in the day. So here are some ways to deal with them to get him to stop using them against me:

Null Rod: This was my favorite means to deal with them. Again this is something that I only included when I was playing against my friend and pretty much never went into any of my "take all comers" lists

Psychic Hood: Not as dependable as Null Rod , but better in an all comers list. If you can shoot them with a bunch of storm bolters they'll die quickly

LR w/just about any GK unit: This allows you to outmaneuver them, get close enough to guarantee shooting, and then charge them.

With the new codex you've got sanctuary as Zeal mentioned, the SR, Interceptors w/shunt, and purifiers w/cleansing flame would be decent as well.

I don't think astral aim would work against veil of tears, but there might be an argument there?

I'd say based on your situation that a librarian is your best bet.

Good Luck

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by Aubec le noir on Mon Jun 27, 2011 9:33 am

yes absolutely ... you need a librarian ... nearly a must for <1500 points army imho
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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by Rivan on Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:43 am

Brothers Z pretty much summed it up very well and I second Coyote's suggestions.

I know its not very feasible for a low-point game but even a small squad of interceptors would have done you wonders. Harlequins..hmmm, okay, I'll shunt over next to them and incinerator/psybolt them to death Razz

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by Zealadin on Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:58 pm

Keep in mind that a hood won't stop Veil of Tears. It doesn't work as a psychic power, so cannot be blocked. That being said I have a feeling that in the past FAQ's have stated that a null rod allows the VoT to be ignored. Not 100% sure though.

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by DonFer on Tue Jun 28, 2011 7:24 am

I'd say for 500 pts game you could try to include a purgation squad. Great way of having heavy fire in your army.

As Brother Z said, we as GK aren't able to bring much numbers to the table, specially in small games. As an example, for a 500 pts game I once took:

1x B Champ.
1x SS 10 man, 2 Psycannons
1x Purg Squad, 4 Psycannons

This build really worked for me, but it'll all depend on what your preferences are.

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by Valten on Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:38 pm

Right then, so today was the first day of the 750 doubles. Before the game I managed to get a 1000 point game in against a Blood Angels player. I managed to table him by turn 4 - it helped that he deep stuck too close to my warp quaking strike squad and his LRC was destroyed! I was on a high.

My list for the tournament is Librarian, 4 powers, 8 Purifiers, 2 psycannons, hammer, 3 halberds, Terminators with psycannon and assault cannon psybolt dreadnought.
My blood angel partner has a captain, tactical squad with missile launcher, terminator squad, Baal pred, and multi melta dreadnought. All in all not a bad total list in my opinion.

However, we were destroyed by turn 4...

We played against Eldar and Dark Eldar.

The Eldar player was the one who wiped me out last week. Farseer, harlequins, dire avengers, 2 d cannons and some striking scorpions. Dark Eldar had a basic archon, some warriors with dark lance and splinter cannons, 2 wych (sp) squads and a razorwing fighter.

It was a 3 objective game, with two on their side of the board. We played too defensively, worrying about the shatterfield missiles on the razorwing. We managed to steal the initiative but basically sat in our cover. I managed to take out all of the wyches at range, even though one of the squads had FNP. I knew I wouldn't be able to get a shot on the harlequins due to veil of tears. I just got out of combat with the second squad of wyches with my Terminators when they got hit by both d cannons...

The wyches were in our deployment wrecking the tactical squad so we decided to quit whilst we were behind...

Not a good start. Second game will be in two weeks against the losers of another game. Completely disappointed with how the game went. Next time I am just going to run everything towards the enemy and hope for the best.

The list I've given above stays the same throughout. So using what I've got, do you guys have any ideas?

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by Zealadin on Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:05 pm

You should try and get your purifiers into combat with the Harlies, PF will absolutely destroy them at the start of combat.
You'll probably kill half the squad with that alone.
If you can combat squad its even better since you feed them one combat squad and then should have the chance to shoot.
You can't really ignore VoT you have to use something that will be fast enough to get them anyway, or a vehicle. (Dread or something with flamers is good).
Also remember you can get lucky on your rolls and get a double 6 for 24" range and suddenly shoot him in the face.
He has to gamble with fleet to get to you without being shot.

I would probably recommend making that a 10 man purifier squad with more PsyC, an Psyflemen dread, and maybe summoning on the Lib if you don't already have it. That way you can draw the Harlies towards a squad and then summon them away to safety.
Or a TP homer on the Lib, and maybe a GKSS squad with an Incin to TP into battle and flamer something (good versus wyches, harlies, rangers, horde etc)

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by Valten on Fri Jul 01, 2011 1:31 am

Good ideas.

After each game I'm having with a smaller sized force I'm realising how much we are out-ranged by our enemies. My original 1500 point force that I planned for had two Stormravens in it, but now I'm thinking of dropping them, having 2 Psyrifle Dreadnoughts and a squad of interceptors.

Footslogging around the board is really hard, especially when facing much faster opponents; and I am learning this the hard way.

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

Post by DonFer on Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:21 am

Try transports, though common they're our best choices to survive the midfield.

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Re: Shocking day of gaming

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