Entry question

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Entry question

Post by Pyriel on Sat Aug 05, 2017 9:56 am

Howdy. I have a question for anyone here that knows the answer for certain.

We are told by gw that though codex space marines has several units removed such as for example the librarian on bike these can nevertheless be taken since previous codex (codex imp 1) entries can be taken.

So far so good.
The issue becomes of entries that are not deleted, we ar told that the newest entry always overrules older ones BUT the question is what about wargear option removed in an entry in codex SM from codex imp 1?

For example, space marines in codex imp 1 has the razorback entry. In it you can take heavy flamer turrets.

In the later (and thus superceeding) codex SM we still have the razorback entry but this time its wargear options do not have the heavy flamer.

Can a SM player thus STILL legally opt to take a heavy flamer turret on his razorback when building a SM army from codex SM?



I need to know before ordering a shitload of expensive conversion bits from FW.

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Re: Entry question

Post by Aubec le noir on Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:16 am

I ask today to the manager of the GW store in Nice the same question (about the storm shield for the librarian)... he had it in the index 1 but not in the codex... and his answer was clear : it's the gear in the codex that counts... for him you can't play the librarian with the index gear ! Evil or Very Mad
I guess it's the same for your razorback... Wink
Btw our codex si coming the 12 august in France 🇫🇷
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Re: Entry question

Post by Pyriel on Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:26 am

Funny, people converted shield libbies like mad after codex imp hit the shelves and not all of a sudden it is not ok, lol.

Thing is I am very suspicious regarding what gw shop managers say.
You should have asked him, just to check, about the bike librarian if he "thought" you can take on in a sm army. If he says no then he doesnt know what he is talking about in the first place.

I guess the final answer for us would have to come from a main tournament organizer or maybe the playtesting people themselves such as frontline gaming. I have asked them but still no reply.

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Re: Entry question

Post by Pyriel on Sat Aug 05, 2017 11:15 am

This is my question to frontline:





Wargear options codex SM vs index imp1 from warhammer community are contradictionary.

Which one is true regarding librarian storm shields, rifleman dreadnoughts and razorback heavy flamer turrets for example.


This is what GW has so far written themselves on this matter:

1:
"Can I combine units from the index and a codex into one army?
The datasheets in the new codexes overwrite the same datasheets in the index books. You can certainly use units with updated datasheets alongside units from the index that have yet to be updated. Once a unit has been covered in the codex though, we assume youíre using the latest version."

Clearly saying a new datasheet overrides an older so no librarian stormshields or heavy flamer turrets.

But from the same article..

2:
"There are a few options that are missing in the codex that appear in the index: why is that? Does that mean I canít use these models in my army anymore?
While the indexes are designed to cover a long history of miniatures, the codexes are designed to give you rules for the current Warhammer 40,000 range. There are a few options in the indexes for some Characters and vehicles that are no longer represented in the Citadel range Ė certain Dreadnought weapons that donít come in the box, or some characters on bikes, for example.
Donít worry though, you can still use all of these in your games if you have these older models. In these instances, use the datasheet from the index, and the most recent points published for that model and its weapons (currently, also in the index).
They still gain all the army wide-bonuses for things like Chapter Tactics and can use Space Marines Stratagems and the like, so such venerable heroes still fit right in with the rest of your army."



This time clearly you can use older entries (dreadnought/wargear given as example).

Please clarify this so that we may know which is the official way to go. CAN or CANīT older wargear options available in index imp 1 but missing in codex SM be taken?


Maybe you could post a short article about this since I am far from the only person wondering about this as well as risking expensive model purchases from FW that may or may not be tabletop legal to use.

Thanks.

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Re: Entry question

Post by Aubec le noir on Wed Aug 09, 2017 1:58 am

Ok... we will wait the answer then !... scratch
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Re: Entry question

Post by Pyriel on Wed Aug 09, 2017 8:44 am

No reply yet. Instead Iīm being laughed at at their forums by people saying there is absolutely no contradiction to be seen anywhere. All while the question is under the noses of and being blatantly ignored by the "officials" over there.

If you read what i posted above with geedubs two different statements on this..do you see there is a contradiction or not?

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Re: Entry question

Post by Aubec le noir on Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:04 am

Yes i see a legit interrogation too !! Wink
That's why i don't go on forums except this one !... too many trolls in there ! Razz
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Re: Entry question

Post by Aubec le noir on Fri Aug 25, 2017 4:16 am

Hi Brother Pyriel..
Still no answer from GW about your question ?? scratch
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Re: Entry question

Post by Pyriel on Fri Aug 25, 2017 12:18 pm

Nope. I take the silence that anything goes, if people are questioning this I just point them out to the rule that if you have an old model it is STILL usable despite not being represented in the newest datasheet. Moronic but if geedub put that on print and both rules exist then you cant force me to abandon my minis because that brakes one of the contradictionary rules AND goes against the spirit of the game.

I win!


lol

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Re: Entry question

Post by Aubec le noir on Sat Aug 26, 2017 7:31 am

😁😁
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Storm shield

Post by Springpinn on Tue Oct 10, 2017 11:36 am

Pyriel wrote:This is my question to frontline:





Wargear options codex SM vs index imp1 from warhammer community are contradictionary.

Which one is true regarding librarian storm shields, rifleman dreadnoughts and razorback heavy flamer turrets for example.


This is what GW has so far written themselves on this matter:

1:
"Can I combine units from the index and a codex into one army?
The datasheets in the new codexes overwrite the same datasheets in the index books. You can certainly use units with updated datasheets alongside units from the index that have yet to be updated. Once a unit has been covered in the codex though, we assume youíre using the latest version."

Clearly saying a new datasheet overrides an older so no librarian stormshields or heavy flamer turrets.

But from the same article..

2:
"There are a few options that are missing in the codex that appear in the index: why is that? Does that mean I canít use these models in my army anymore?
While the indexes are designed to cover a long history of miniatures, the codexes are designed to give you rules for the current Warhammer 40,000 range. There are a few options in the indexes for some Characters and vehicles that are no longer represented in the Citadel range Ė certain Dreadnought weapons that donít come in the box, or some characters on bikes, for example.
Donít worry though, you can still use all of these in your games if you have these older models. In these instances, use the datasheet from the index, and the most recent points published for that model and its weapons (currently, also in the index).
They still gain all the army wide-bonuses for things like Chapter Tactics and can use Space Marines Stratagems and the like, so such venerable heroes still fit right in with the rest of your army."



This time clearly you can use older entries (dreadnought/wargear given as example).

Please clarify this so that we may know which is the official way to go. CAN or CANīT older wargear options available in index imp 1 but missing in codex SM be taken?


Maybe you could post a short article about this since I am far from the only person wondering about this as well as risking expensive model purchases from FW that may or may not be tabletop legal to use.

Thanks.


I'm still curious about this... Any word?
Where did you read this article? link?
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Re: Entry question

Post by Pyriel on Tue Oct 10, 2017 12:35 pm

Nope. I think it was all from warhammer community but dont remember. The important thing is that these are gws words.

As for frontline, nothing, after being laughed out of there with this question and later on even sending it to them in their capacity as tournamnet organizers as a tournament question they handled it by simply not responding what so ever.

I have stopped asking frontline anything since they are only there to sell and fill their forums with yes man fanboys. Pretty much a bunch of holier then thou fuckheads.

If you want this answered try posting it as a question in one of the big 40k forums like dakka and see what they say. So far as I understand it the take on this is that what you want goes.

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