ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

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ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by SmokinBrown on Wed May 01, 2013 8:45 pm

Was just wondering which effect applies first, the increase in ballistic skill from tau markerlights or the reduction from the UPS?

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by DonFer on Thu May 02, 2013 8:52 am

If answered by GW, you should roll out to see what applies first... yes stupid I know but that's how it is.

However, I think a better way to resolve timing problems is a Magic approach to the matter. If you are the active player you choose which rule applies first, if not then your opponent chooses which rule applies first.

I found this to be actually much better than to discuss endlessly about which triggers first. Another example for this is NFW and FNP rolls.

If I rememer correctly, this is mentioned somewher in the BRB, however I can't seem to find it firsthand. But hope it helps.

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by SmokinBrown on Thu May 02, 2013 9:12 am

Thanks for your input. After you mentioned it was somewhere in the book I also recalled reading it and managed to dig out the ruling...

Page 2, multiple modifiers

"If a model has a combination of rules or wargear that modify a characteristic, first apply any multliers, then apply any additions or subtractions, and finally apply any set values."

So that's pretty clear, if marker lights are used then the bs remains at 1 due to the plasma syphon. It also means a daemon hammer used with hammerhand is strength 9 Sad

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by Rivan on Thu May 02, 2013 9:43 am

DonFer wrote:If answered by GW, you should roll out to see what applies first... yes stupid I know but that's how it is.

However, I think a better way to resolve timing problems is a Magic approach to the matter. If you are the active player you choose which rule applies first, if not then your opponent chooses which rule applies first.

I found this to be actually much better than to discuss endlessly about which triggers first. Another example for this is NFW and FNP rolls.

If I rememer correctly, this is mentioned somewher in the BRB, however I can't seem to find it firsthand. But hope it helps.

For the NFW vs FNP rule, GW FAQ actually answered that: NFW triggers first so if successful, no FNP rolls allowed Smile

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by SmokinBrown on Thu May 02, 2013 10:04 am

Rivan wrote:
DonFer wrote:If answered by GW, you should roll out to see what applies first... yes stupid I know but that's how it is.

However, I think a better way to resolve timing problems is a Magic approach to the matter. If you are the active player you choose which rule applies first, if not then your opponent chooses which rule applies first.

I found this to be actually much better than to discuss endlessly about which triggers first. Another example for this is NFW and FNP rolls.

If I rememer correctly, this is mentioned somewher in the BRB, however I can't seem to find it firsthand. But hope it helps.

For the NFW vs FNP rule, GW FAQ actually answered that: NFW triggers first so if successful, no FNP rolls allowed Smile

This is also good to hear Smile

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by SmokinBrown on Thu May 02, 2013 11:19 am

Also, it is stated in the feel no pain rule itself...

"Note that feel no pain rolls cannot be taken against wounds that inflict instant death"

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by first strike on Thu May 02, 2013 5:20 pm

SmokinBrown wrote:Thanks for your input. After you mentioned it was somewhere in the book I also recalled reading it and managed to dig out the ruling...

Page 2, multiple modifiers

"If a model has a combination of rules or wargear that modify a characteristic, first apply any multliers, then apply any additions or subtractions, and finally apply any set values."

So that's pretty clear, if marker lights are used then the bs remains at 1 due to the plasma syphon. It also means a daemon hammer used with hammerhand is strength 9 Sad

SB
Sorry, wrong on the hammer hand, page 25 of the Grey knight codex explains how to do hammer hand in the case of hammers. Codex over Rule book every time.

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by DonFer on Fri May 03, 2013 7:40 am

Rivan wrote:
DonFer wrote:If answered by GW, you should roll out to see what applies first... yes stupid I know but that's how it is.

However, I think a better way to resolve timing problems is a Magic approach to the matter. If you are the active player you choose which rule applies first, if not then your opponent chooses which rule applies first.

I found this to be actually much better than to discuss endlessly about which triggers first. Another example for this is NFW and FNP rolls.

If I rememer correctly, this is mentioned somewher in the BRB, however I can't seem to find it firsthand. But hope it helps.

For the NFW vs FNP rule, GW FAQ actually answered that: NFW triggers first so if successful, no FNP rolls allowed Smile

Wow I missed that completely. Gotta have to read the whole FAQ again. Where was it, in the GK or the Rulebook FAQ?

EDIT: Never mind I found it. Thanks for the heads up Rivan! Cheers!


Last edited by DonFer on Fri May 03, 2013 7:45 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by DonFer on Fri May 03, 2013 7:42 am

SmokinBrown wrote:Also, it is stated in the feel no pain rule itself...

"Note that feel no pain rolls cannot be taken against wounds that inflict instant death"

SB

The point with FNP vs. NFW is that force weapons do not inflict ID by themselves, they have to be activated to do that. So, when do you activate it if FNP activates at the same time? Hence the discussion and later the FAQ to that problem. cheers

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

Post by SmokinBrown on Sat May 04, 2013 4:36 am

Ahh I see now yeah, thanks for the clarification Smile

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Re: ulumeathi plasma syphon vs markerlights

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