Tau, Tau Tau, Shoot, Shoot and shoot some more

[quote="Sai"]

A deathstar can only kill a unit a turn after all. Send Thawn, he likes taking plasma to the face.

Sadly, this isn't the case with the Farisght Star. Due to the Target Lock wargear, each suit can target a different unit. The typical star has one support suit with no weapons which has wargear that twin-links all other squad member weapons as well as allows them to ignore cover saves, and six suits with 2x plasma guns (str 6 no gets hot plasma) , fusion blasters (18" melta guns) or missile pods (autocannon with 36" range). These may shoot at any unit they wish, not bound by anything else in the squad. Farisight got a single plasma gun which he fires at the main target. The star often takes 10-14 gun drones with pulse carbines, which means 20-28 str 5 ap 5 shots as well. These also target the main target. If the star adds Shadowsun, they get 2 more fusion blasters of which one may target an independent target and one must target the main one. She also gives them shrouded and stealth, so 2+ cover in area terrain. For 9 suits and 14 drones.

It's a tough unit which can target eight units a turn if it so wishes.

Yeesh. And a 7/8 suit version seems to come in at under 800 points too. You'd have thought something that nasty would be held back for apocalypse games.

By turn 5 Thawn is likely going to be the only knight left.


A riptide with an ion cannon and interceptor upgrade would actually be an ideal counter, but I expect you'd just take out a lot of drones before having it shot to pieces.

A fortress of redemption with krakstorm missiles might help unless the farsight posse just land in front of it and fusion blast it into rubble. It's too many points anyway.

Yeah this is a nasty piece of work. I have been browsing other forums and they are calling it one of the scariest death star ever created, and I have to agree. My buddy who plays tau was not only able to fit in a ripetide but also 2 hammerheads, with 2 squads of 11 fire warriors I believe for in around 1500-1750pts but it could be more.

Because of its sheer silliness I dont think people will run them to often in friendly matches but in the tourney circuit, I think this will be one of the more popular lists just because it can produce results.

This unit may be able to split fire to 8 different units but will not take down 8 units in a turn, so will normaly only be looking at split fire to 2 units, (unless there are a lot of vechicles and Fussion Blasters), also at 8 suits and 10 to 14 drones, this is a big footprint, it will be looking to spread out after shooting, so catching it will be eaisier, hand to hand is still the way to go. With a 2+ cover save shooting it is a waist of ammo.

+1 to what first strike said, force it to land at a specific location with warp quake bubbles, then assault. Paladins should do the trick or DCA's. Paladins with a banner will do it no problem.

One thing to mention, 3 acolytes with plasma guns is 42 points, not 32. Sorry

Also, hammer on dreadknight is a bit of a waste of points now that doomfists make it strength 10. That could save you those extra 10 points

SB

thanks guys I think i wrote 42 down on paper here but mistyped it on the forum good eye SB

I actually ended up dropping the dreadknight altogether and changed the interceptor squad to a 5 man with incinerator. i ended up freeing up 385pts so i tossed in a bare bones SS with another razorback with assault cannon and then upgraded the justicar termies to Thawn.

Paladins could be a possible alternative to the termies, they can give me more fire power, and they do have 2 wounds, I can get 4 for 220pt, 2 psycannons is another 40pt should I drop in an apothecary for another 75pt to increase potential survival chances?

Here is what i will do. I will write up 3 lists using the core of the original list posted above. One will reflect the first changes I made, i.e. with thawn upgrade. Another will be with DCAs and crusaders and the final one with Pallies. It may take me a bit so bare with me.

At only 4 strong id leave the apothecary, its a whole additional paladin and a bit in points. I usually run my paladins 5 strong, 2 with halberd and incinerator at the front, with an IC between them (usually Draigo), 2 with a hammer at the back with a banner between the 2 of them. But thats inside a crusader, kitted for CC. If you're foot slogging it then yeah go for psycannons for the extra range, but I would recommend just a mix of halberds and hammers really, either 2/2 or 3/1, up to you or what you're facing (I have one of mine pinned so I can change it ). But I have the hammers at the back so that if the paladins take wounds theyll be on the halberds (which should have already struck) and you'll still get to attack with the hammers.

SB

yeah i normally run my pallies with a mix of halberds and hammers. They will more than likely be foot slogging so I will probably attach psycannons. The character that i will put with them is the ordo xenos inquistor with the plasma syphon just to give them that added protection.

yeah good choice. Do you just run the plasma syphon or do you take rad grenades and psyker too? With rad grenades, UPS, psyker (for prescience) and power armour I think he comes in at 88 points, not too bad really, definitely provides more than 88pts of extra killiness to paladins.

SB

I do like rad grenades lol if I have the points I will probably kit the inquisitor out a little bit. Rad grenades, and the plasma syphon tend to be the first few things I add on. Power armor and Psyker mastery are thing I will only add on if I am looking to fill up space.

With this particular list I was more concerned with getting enough bodies to endure the farsight bomb so that i don't get tabled after 3 turns.

syphon sounds like a good choice then. use the warp quake bubbles to try and force them to land in range of a countercharge from the paladins. Or just hope they mishap lol, would hurt if they rolled a 6 on the table.

SB

lol yeah it would be nice if he mishap happened, but with farsight as the warlord, the bomb wont scatter :S

but yeah how what have mentioned is probably how I would go about handling the bomb itself. Warpquake bubbles to set it up and then the charge from the pallies.

Thanks for your insight SB really appreciate it.

It's alright. I didn't realise about farsight, I don't actually own the tau codex, but my mate plays them. Does he automatically arrive on the first turn too?

SB

No which is probably the only positive thing about facing the farsight bomb in my opinion. lol its reassuring to know I cant be tabled on turn one

I wanna try it wish I was rich and could just buy armies when I wanted lol I hope my friend who plays Tau never discovers this tactic

SB

How do you guys think Draigowing would hold up against Farsight bomb?

I've been reading up on the Bomb a lot lately, but have yet to see a Deathstar vs Deathstar comparison.

Naturally, it will depend on how many Fusion Blasters the Bomb takes. What's the norm?

most i encountered played with a plasma, fusion blaster and flamer. one of them without weapons to get the ignore cover and twin linked for his unit.

Well that's not enough to take out draigo and a unit of pallies, especially if theyre in a landraider. As long as you can assault them I think suits and farsight are no match for draigo and pallies, just need to get them to land in assault range.

SB

SmokinBrown wrote:Well that's not enough to take out draigo and a unit of pallies, especially if theyre in a landraider. As long as you can assault them I think suits and farsight are no match for draigo and pallies, just need to get them to land in assault range.

SB

I wouldn't be so sure. I'm intending to dust of my old Tau and pull together a Farisght bomb of my own, simply because it's seems wickedly fun to have a swiss army knife unit which can target anything and everything. Thus I've read up quite a lot on it. The bomb can have 14 (+ 3 special) drones as ablative wounds which you'll have to chew through before the suits can be hurt. And when it comes to combat results, the unit is stubborn on leadership 10 due to the signature system "Puretide Engram Neurochip" which allows the model to choose between Monster Hunter, Tank Hunter, Stubborn, Furious Charge or Counter-Attack (of which the first three transfer to the unit) every turn. And if you do break them, you cannot sweep them due to Terminator Armour. On top of this, due to the support system "Vectored Retro Thrusters", the bomb has Hit & Run, which is tested on Farsight's initiative 5. Thus, you can't safely lock it in as they'll probably leave the assault to blast you away the following turn.

If Shadowsun is the warlord of the force, they also get a 3d6 JSJ move after shooting. This means that if they Melta the Land Raider at 9" away, they then get to jump an average 10" backwards leaving the paladin star out of maximum charge distance. The next turn they (using my intended star build) throw 28 S5 shots, 8 S7 shots, 14 S6 AP2 shots (2 on BS5) and 4 S8 AP1 (2 at BS5) shots into the paladins, BS3 with twin-link on most stuff. This will on average cause the paladin star 19 savable wounds, 9 AP2 wounds and 3 ap 1 instant death wounds. Now, let's assume Draigo stands up front. The 19 normal wounds cause 3 unsaved wounds on Draigo, which then saves 2 out of 3 AP2 shots before dying. Assuming the paladins don't have swords, you then go on to save 2 out of 6 more none-ID wounds and 1 out of 3 ID wounds. This means 3 dead paladins, which if they were in a land raider crusader translates into 4 remaining paladins in the unit. If the bomb has riptide support (you can bring 2 in a 1500 bomb list) they'll also have to survive S8 AP2 large blast templates. Without Draigo up front, the numbers will be even worse. And a typical Draigo star pretty much equals a Farsight Bomb in points cost, while being nowhere as strong in killing power.

That being said, assault is probably still the greatest option. Nothing can win a shooting war against that unit.

[The loadout of my intended star is 3 suits with dual plasma (24" S6 AP2 Rapid Fire), 1 suit with dual fusion (18" S8 AP1 Melta Assault 1), 2 suits with dual Missile pods (30" S7 AP4 Assault 2), Farsight with a plasma and Shadowsun with 2 fusion. On top of this, a suit with support systems and 14 Gun Drones each with S5 AP5 Assault 2 pinning weapons.]

On a side note, I've been considered trying out a a method I've encountered on making the star even more wicked. Ally in a C:SM librarian with terminator army and epistolary (mastery 2). Take the powers Null Zone and Gate of Infinity. Null Zone forces all opponents within 24" of the caster to re-roll successful invulnerable saves, the only save you can take against all the plasma and fusion shooting of the star. Gate of Infinity allows you to re-deep strike the unit the same turn within 24" of its position, and with Farsight as warlord they do not scatter. This means the bomb can now move 24" and also completely re-arrange what model is facing where every round, allowing one to slingshot melta carriers almost 30". Being caught by assault units now require much more effort on their behalf, and the threat bubble extends to roughly 40".

With Null Zone activated, 2 more paladins would die, for a total of Draigo and 5 Paladins in one round. That's 550 points without upgrades, in one round of shooting. One direct hit from a Riptide and you would have 1-2 paladins left standing out of 10, and a star out of play. With Feel No Pain, this would of course reduce the casualty rate, but it is still rather extreme. In return, a Draigo star with 4 cannons and prescience up would cause 3 wounds if the bomb is in cover, or 8-9 if they are outside of it depending on who saves what. All these casualties would most probably be drones, perhaps one suit.

...the Farsight Bomb is a mean unit.

Oops, I'd just woken up and for some stupid reason thought he meant one plasma and one fusion blaster in the entire squad haha.

The only thing I can think of is taking Coteaz in a chimera with henchmen including enough psykers for a large blast powerful enough to instagib the suits, plus 3 plasma gun acolytes and a plasma servitor, then using warp quake bubbles from rhinos to force 1 safe landing site in the middle of all those vehicles, tempting for a farsight star, especially in purge the alien. make sure the chimera with coteaz is within 12" of the landing site, and take another inquisitor with servo skulls and put them 6" from the rhinos so they don't get destroyed when the bomb lands, but are close enough to the unit for templates, then open up with the henchman band. The templates have 2/3 chance of not scattering at all, and if it does only a maximum of 3", and the bomb will be in base contact from just deepstriking which translates to a lot of hits. The drones will presumably be in a ring on the outside of the bomb to weather fire from all directions, so the plasma gun acolytes can take out the drones on the side closest to the chimera (make sure you used prescience), allowing the wounds from the plasma cannon servitor and the psykers to take out suits, quite possibly all of them, before they have chance to shoot.

Its quite situational, but the list is extremely tailored lol. Just one solution though.

Another solution, Tau allies with interceptor??

SB

SmokinBrown wrote:Oops, I'd just woken up and for some stupid reason thought he meant one plasma and one fusion blaster in the entire squad haha.

The only thing I can think of is taking Coteaz in a chimera with henchmen including enough psykers for a large blast powerful enough to instagib the suits, plus 3 plasma gun acolytes and a plasma servitor, then using warp quake bubbles from rhinos to force 1 safe landing site in the middle of all those vehicles, tempting for a farsight star, especially in purge the alien. make sure the chimera with coteaz is within 12" of the landing site, and take another inquisitor with servo skulls and put them 6" from the rhinos so they don't get destroyed when the bomb lands, but are close enough to the unit for templates, then open up with the henchman band. The templates have 2/3 chance of not scattering at all, and if it does only a maximum of 3", and the bomb will be in base contact from just deepstriking which translates to a lot of hits. The drones will presumably be in a ring on the outside of the bomb to weather fire from all directions, so the plasma gun acolytes can take out the drones on the side closest to the chimera (make sure you used prescience), allowing the wounds from the plasma cannon servitor and the psykers to take out suits, quite possibly all of them, before they have chance to shoot.

Its quite situational, but the list is extremely tailored lol. Just one solution though.

Another solution, Tau allies with interceptor??

SB

Indeed, the bombs weakest aspect is the roughly 7" diameter foot print it has, and Coteaz is our greatest counter. Watch out though, for if the Bomb is able to land in area terrain it'd have a 2+ cover save to boot. Even without a base 5+, they still have shrouded and stealth giving them a 4+ against everything. You're wrong about the drones though, they'd probably all be facing Coteaz since they get to move 2d6" in their assault phase to reposition before you get to shoot (jet packs). This means you'd have to cause 28 wounds (hits and then vs T4) in order to kill all the drones on average if they're out in the open, or 84 wounds if they're in cover. And this is only to remove the drones. Sure thing, if the bomb is left in the open and your psykers pass their test and don't get denied (60% odds without allied psyker in the bomb), you'd probably see the maximum of 23 hits caused by the psyker template of which 19 wounds, and prescienced the plasma would net average 11.5 hits (if the template causes the maximum of 7 hits), which translates into 9,6 wounds. That's 28,75 wounds, meaning you'd wipe the drones on average if they're out in the open. You'd only kill 5 drones if there's intervening/area terrain available to drop behind/in.

If I were to play a bomb vs this Coteaz counter, I'd probably deploy on table instead, behind some infiltrating kroot in cover. With Shadowsun as warlord, that means average 16" move per turn with JSJ, and no issues with Warp Quake. At higher point games, Riptides could probably wipe out a Warp Quaking squad before the bomb deploys, leaving an opening. If I would use a teleport libby, I would probably just deploy on table and move forward 24" turn one if you haven't had the chance to quake yet, outside of Coteaz, or going second I'd land outside of the quake range of a strike squad and wipe it of the table to allow myself to flank Coteaz. Note that the missile pod suits would cause 5 unsaveable wounds to henchmen at 30" range - if only a couple of those are psykers, there is no longer any risk in closing in with Coteaz. Then again, my Knights list uses Coteaz as warlord with a unit bursting with plasma in order to counter deep striking lists, so against a Tau player with little experience of our Inquisitor lord this bait strategy might work. The most common advice bomb players are giving is to not Deep Strike the bomb though, but rather use Shadowsun as warlord with her 3d6 JSJ trait.

Allied Tau with riptides and markerlights are probably the strongest counter to the bomb, but not using interceptor. Intercepting, you have no markerlight support and the bomb would get its insane cover save. Using markerlights in your turn, you can both up the BS of your riptide and strip the cover of the bomb for -all- units firing at it that turn. Then again, markerlights would be the first priority target of the bomb.

The drones wouldn't be able to move after deepstriking, Coteaz and his unit attack immediately after the bomb arrives with his "I've been waiting for you" rule or whatever its called before they get to do anything.

I would only expect what I outlined to work against a player who had not faced Coteaz before, which tbf is unlikely at a competitive level. I've never played competitively myself though, I think the lists required to win at that level are boring =/

Also, the Gate of Infinity trick wouldn't work, seeing as it targets the psyker and his unit and the sorcerer could not join the unit as they are only allies of convenience.

SB

SmokinBrown wrote:The drones wouldn't be able to move after deepstriking, Coteaz and his unit attack immediately after the bomb arrives with his "I've been waiting for you" rule or whatever its called before they get to do anything.

I would only expect what I outlined to work against a player who had not faced Coteaz before, which tbf is unlikely at a competitive level. I've never played competitively myself though, I think the lists required to win at that level are boring =/

Also, the Gate of Infinity trick wouldn't work, seeing as it targets the psyker and his unit and the sorcerer could not join the unit as they are only allies of convenience.

SB

The drones are allowed to JSJ in their assault phase, using their Jet packs. Only during the movement phase may a unit not move further after deep striking. That means an average 7" move for the drones in the assault phase. Indeed, Coteaz would attack the bomb before they get to do that though, but it is not hard to place the models so that all drones are in front of the suits when placing them in the deep strike circle. As you can see from my math, if the psykers manage their test and don't get denied all drones would be wiped on average, if the unit is not in cover. The suits still get to fight though, meaning things around them would take a beating.

Indeed, competitive play seems rather dull. I believe I'm going to leave the bomb on the shelf when facing friends, as long as I want to keep them. ...at least after I've tried it out.

Codex: Space Marines are actually battle brothers with Tau, unbelievably enough. Probably due to the Tau/Ultramarines truce from the Fire Warrior video game. This means that GoI and Null Zone will work just fine, making it a monster of a unit.

ahhh I thought you meant Chaos Space Marines when you said CSM lol, that's my bad. Wow yeah that is one mean unit, I'd do that instead of deepstriking it.

SB

If you're taking allies you could get 3 colossus for under 450 points. Keep them out of LoS and use your warp quakes to make sure the bomb stays out of 24" and then just drop S6AP3 cover ignoring pie plates on them. Buy a fortress of retribution, plonk it in a corner and use it to block LoS to the artillery with strike squads inside singing songs of warp quake freedom. You'll also have another krakstorm ordinance blast and the icarus lascannons to throw in. And an ordinance officer from the Guard HQ calling down bombardments.
Every turn shout 'all guns repeat' like you mean it.

A collossus has a 24-240" range, so as long as you are 12 " in from of the fortress with your quakes going the arty is mostly safe and they can hit the blueskin where ever he deploys. It's a 7" footprint, you're likely to hit something even when firing blind. Keeping them safe from the rest of the tau army would be the challenge.

The fortress, the colossi, the command with bombardments and the vet squad would come to about 800 points which is the same as the deathstar if it's maxed out. I think. I'm just going on what I've read on forums.