Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

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Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by first strike on Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:11 pm

My list
Coteaz
10 man strike squad psybolts, 2 x psycannons, Hammer, Justicar with Halberd, Rhino
9 man strike squad psybolts, 1 x psycannons, Justicar with Halberd, Rhino
10 man interceptor squad psybolts, 2 x incinerators, Hammer, Justicar with Halberd
3 x 3 man acolote squads with stormbolters, 2 razors with T.L. Las and a chimera
3 x Rifle Dreads.
Stormraven with T.L Las and T.L M.Melta
His List
Necron Lord, res orb and stalf of light
6 x 8 man warrior squads with 6 x Night scyths
3 x Doom scyths
Agis with Quad gun.
I always new this was going to be a tough match up and had a plan of attack before going in. It did not work. I never thought that I would be able to take this list out, but if it was an objective game then I may be able to out play it. This is not to say that I was not in the game but O.M.G. this list is tough.
Mssion was Big Guns never tire (5 objectives and heavy units score) with Hammer and Anvil deployment (long ways (I thnk this was one thing that did not help me in this game))
The first 2 turns my opp thought it was all over (I had first turn). At the end of the game I had killed the quad gun, 2 squads of warriors, half killed 3 of the others, droped one night scyth, removed the guns from another, droped a doom scyth and removed a gun (the teslar) from another and locked velocity on the other one. I had lost both strike squad, both rhinos, both razors, the chimera, 2 dreads and had the locked veloicty on the stormraven. I held 1objective to 3 and was glad to see the end of turn 5. My advice to anybody planing on going to a tournament is to play at least one game aginst this type of list. If it is a hard tournament then you will run into it if you are winning games. My opp was running this list for the first time (he normaly playes space wolves and is a junior (15 years old but I think a 10 year old run this list)). Things that I would change from this game is when against this list is get up in its face from the start, kill all the ground troops, deep strike in the strike squads and go to town on them (if he starts them on the board). The firepower coming form these flyers will mess you up, my opp was getting an average of 6 hits from the teslar destructors from every flyer.

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Guest on Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:57 pm

Finally I've sat down with some spare time to post a reply! :O

Firstly... would you like a towel? Sounds like you got raped!

Secondly... Damn man, I feel for you, Cron. Air cav. is definitely a hard comp list and quite difficult to play against.

Now onto the actually game. i dont have the rule book infront of me right now but i think that even as a decdicated transport he cant start the flyers on the board. All flyers but come in as reserves. Im about 80% sure of this. But check the rule book.
Also, how did you deploy your dreads? I always game with citadel terrain. The rules state that you can deploy walkers at higher levels of the ruins, IF the ruins are "stable" so I always aim for my dreads to get some form of cover, either ground floor, first floor and so on. Thats what it takes at a competitive level, And my dreads are the back bone and work horses of the army. Also, on that note, with 48 inches, of range. Even on Hammer & Anvil I still deploy back a bit(not right up to the line) of the deployment zone.

Secondly, and you probably already did this because you're not retarded but i better check. Knowing that you were up against doom scythes, did you spread out your deployment? Even your dreads? IF you bunched up the doom scythe just tears through units. How effective were the Interceptors this game? I assume he spread his flyers out across the board and teleported each unit of warriors to a certain location. The interceptors should have performed brilliantly this game, Shunt to the ruin, flame the warriors... 8 dead warriors. Very Happy

Anyway, Ill reply more later

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Guest on Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:42 pm

What did you take from the game in terms of your lists' strengths and weaknesses. Your acolytes probably could have been replaced by more interceptors to stop his warriors. It didn't look like you were trying to claim objectives. Did his lord sit on the quad gun? Could you have shunted and shot his lord?

Could you have replaced the 3x3 acolytes and their transports for another unit of PAGK's?


Last edited by Grandmaster Arratak on Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:49 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Guest on Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:47 pm

His lord would have been the only thing deployed if he kept his warriors in the night scythes. You should have unloaded, kill it and because he had nothing on the board you actually win. That's a new rule that not many people know about. What was the most lethal thing from his list that killed your units?

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by first strike on Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:23 pm

He deployed all his ground forces on the board, behind the agis, or in cover, so there was no chance of getting a first turn wipeout, the flyers came in turn 2 (2 doom scyths and 3 nights), the rest over the next 2 turns, would have perfered them to have come in all at once.
I was in the game up to turn 4, I held 2 and had the third one covered (so I thought), I just could not take down the flyers fast enough, the isue is hitting them, then once you do, you have to pen the armour, not hard with S7 and 8 guns but you still lose some of your shots and then you have to do damage, basicly half of all pen shots go to waist and do no damage, locked velocity realy does not do that much, and weapon destroyed on a doom scyth still leaves them with a good gun.
The interceptors removed 2 squads and the quad gun so they performed well, not quite there points but I will take it.
As for the doom scyths, they only managed to hit more then one vechile twice in the game and then is was on good rolls, and the teslar weapons never got more then one unit.
Droping the accolites will also remove 2 las cannon razors and a chimera from the list, so while they are not as effective against necron flyers, they do make other armies sit up and take notice, also 3 small scoring units come in handy in some games, will be looking to include a melta in each squad to up the threat of each unit.
As I have said before I will not taylor a list to take on a certian list, this just leaves you open to being unable to counter a different list, and I like tournament play with balanced lists. The reason I have said for anybody who wants to go to tournamnet where this list could come into play is because you need to change the way you play to beat it, and even then it is touch and go, having had one game I think that I am now more ready to handle it.
The army I ran can handle about 5 flyers, nine is just to many and the damage just mounts up.
I do not see a reason to change the list (in a big way) but will change the way I played it next time and will be having a rematch in the next month, to will post more later.

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Guest on Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:14 pm

Fair enough. It's not really tailoring if you do minor tweaks. If your henchman keep under performing would you still keep them? No. You wouldn't.

Sounds nasty, I don't know what I would do against that many flyers. I would probably loose a lot quicker. Thanks for the great write up.

In hindsight, what would you do differently in deployment and the game if you played that again?

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by first strike on Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:47 pm

Yes, and this should go for any game, in an objective mission, kill the scoring troops, for necron flyers, ignore them and kill the ground troops, go after the flyers second, they are the low percentage shots, so make every shot count.
The henchmen are not under performing, they cost 7 points a man (with a storm bolter) and hold objectives. So far I have not had them killed, the strike squads are a bigger threat and can also score, I am sure that they will go down if someone gives them a dirty look but people are saving those for the other units in my army. I am looking a meltas and a plasma in the squads, but I am concerned that this will raise the threat level on the squads and make them bigger targets.

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Guest on Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:26 pm

Yeah I was just contemplating what I would do heading into a game like that. There's no possible way for me to kill 9 flyers. So the next plan of attack is deny him the chance to score. Storm bolters destroy warriors so unleash onto his warriors, focus fire, so his units can't get back up.

Spread out, find as much cover as possible. Hammer and anvil is nasty. It gives the flyers an extra turn to stay on the board. But generally the come on, they zap something and they are off on their turn 3. Rinse repeat. So 2/5 turns in theory the flyers are doing something.

Which is what they were originally designed for. Fire support & escorting. With target denial it should minimise the casualties that are taken.

Anyway this is what I would do in theory. I'd also try go for the secondary objectives. Go for the draw.

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by first strike on Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:56 pm

Objective placement is also key, get into the face of the army, right up in the deployment zone, limit his options, you are going to have a hard time winning so go big or go home.

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Guest on Sun Jan 06, 2013 7:27 pm

The more I think about hammer and anvil and work out the measurements. If he placed the flyers correctly and only moved 18" per turn he would have 3 full turns with the flyers off the board, if you had dreads in the back field then Maybe 4. If you deployed at 24" and moved up 6" every turn with all your units including dreads, hid in cover, ran when you couldn't shoot. That would minimise the efficiency of the flyers. Maybe 1 or 2 turns.

Even his doom scythes were scoring!

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Zealadin on Mon Jan 07, 2013 4:47 am

His list is just optimised to a greater extend than yours...

You have 3 dangerous scoring units, your SR and the dreads that will worry him. Even the dreads aren't that much of a concern when you combine that his transports are flyers (sure they are better than most other available options but they still aren't great against them) with the fact that warriors will be in cover and probably get saves

He has 6 scoring infantry squads which while not super resilient still have WBB, accompanied by 6 transports which just place them and then fly around shooting and causing havoc.

His list is however incredibly boring and dull, in a situation where he faces a better player with a list built to deal with airforce, or say a new codex with AA options he'll find that he is playing a scissor/paper/rock army.

Playing someone like this is best dealt with in a way I normally don't condone - list tailoring.
Get 3 SR's, 3 rifleman dreads, an aegis defence line and then fill out your list with other units optimised against his flyers/warriors.

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Guest on Mon Jan 07, 2013 6:09 am

Necron flyer cheese is boring. Soon everyone will have the "flakk" special rule on their missiles.

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by first strike on Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:43 pm

Yes it is boring and is a list that I would not even concider to play myself, but it is out there, and in the right (or wrong) tournament it will be there more then once, and if you taylor for a tournmant like that (I am not saying that it is not one way to beat that list) you will run into other lists that will ruin your day. I do entend to get as many games in as posible against it to see what I can do (the gamers in my area do not run this list and never would unless I asked them to). Most play more for the fun of the game and not just to win

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Guest on Mon Jan 07, 2013 4:19 pm

I mainly play for fun aswell. But would like to keep the humiliation to a bare minimum. -_-'

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by DonFer on Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:14 am

I don't think list tailoring is necessary to deal with such lists. Necrons hate CC so go full ahead with it. They have to start with something on the table so, focus fire and obliterate it from the table. From then on he has to make sure to have something on the table, making it easier to deal with.
Don't have first turn? flat out to his deployment zone and eliminate his flyer deployement range. He will be forced to think before moving his flyers and of course to make mistakes in the process.

But don't expect to leave the game intact, you will be shot and you will loose units. The point is to deny him the tactical advantage he has with the flyers. and that is not an statinary army but a very mobile and aggressive one. The proof of the matter is CronAir vs. Daemons. I have to still see a Cron player successfully dealing with lots of daemons breathing down his neck.

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

Post by Guest on Fri Jan 11, 2013 2:12 pm

Yeah. I agree donfer, get up in his face!

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Re: Grey Knights V Necron (Con Air)

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