1750 Terminator Based List

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1750 Terminator Based List

Post by Zealadin on Mon Apr 04, 2011 3:58 am

HQ:
OMI (Inq) + Term Arm + PysC + 3 Servo Skulls 89

Elites:
Paladins (5) 4 Halberds, Hammer, 2 PsyC 325

Troops:
GKT (5) PsyC 4 Halberds, Hammer 225*3 = 775
GKSS (10) PsyAmmo 240

HS:
DreadKnight
DreadKnight

(1689)
So I have about 61 points to spend, although I'm tempted to try and find another 19 points to get a second OMI with a similar loadout in there.

All up it has 21 terminator bodies, 10 PAGK, 2 MCs and 6 Psycannons.

I'm still trying to figure out if it will work or if there just isn't enough on the table. The DK's could get GS's for the extra points, but the list is pretty light on... well everything due to trying to include GKT, particularly Paladins. On the bright side all the Psycannons are 100% effecient even on the move.

Its basically a rock (earth) list, but its hard to figure out how to make GKT work.

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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by Slind on Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:37 am

Have you considered merging two of your GKTs into a single unit? You can always Combat Squad them if you need the extra troop choice.

Furthermore, I have found that mixing the cc-weapons up a bit, give you more sustainability, especially during shooting. On a unit of 5 I go: Hammer, 2 x helbard, sword and falchion.

Finally I am a bit curious how you intend to solve the mobility issue - I can se that you intend to DS your army, but how will you manage redeployment or scattered reserves?

Finally, I would consider putting the Inq in a transport along with a mystic and buy Psycic Communion. Now you can guide you DS, plus get a precise DS if the need arise. Finally you Inq can shoot out the hatch due to Stubbon.

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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by Zealadin on Mon Apr 04, 2011 5:53 am

I considered doing a squad of 10, but its not really an issue since its very easy to just convert them into one squad if I feel that would help after play testing.

I'm also not a fan of mixing weapons, its good for wound allocation, but just makes combat a huge pain, plus one of the few things I feel our terminators have going for them is the ability to attack at I6, this greatly reduces attacks back, and gives them an edge over almost anything, even when they are attacked. This being a slow force this is particularly important. If the sword just gave a 4++ instead of a combat only 4++ I would be more impressed.

Servo skulls also means I should be able to reduce scatter to d6, but its not a huge issue since I don't have a way of changing reserve rolls. Its just a backup ability, I would need a GM/BC to play a deepstriking force.

Stubborn also doesn't do anything towards shooting, you just ignore negative modifiers for morale tests. You also can't take a psycannon without termi armour and that means only a chimera might work to fit the termi armour inside (not 100% sure if this works).
That being said your adding a single vehicle to an army that has none, on the assumption it will get far enough in to pull in the rest of your army down.

I also don't want to play my GK with vehicles if I can avoid it, which is why I am leaning towards GKT, but its hard to find a balanced list that doesn't have major drawbacks following this route.
If I do go vehicles I'll probably go with PAGK.

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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by DonFer on Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:55 am

I really would recommend replacing the OMI for a Grand Master. Making your Termies Scouts or your NDK scoring is something you cannot ignore, specially when you're footslogging to your enemy. Servoskulls are really not needed in your list IMHO. If you want them I'd better consider a nice Libby , and he comes in termy armour too.

I'd also put two psycannons on your strike squad, you can never have too many of those.


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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by Slind on Mon Apr 04, 2011 7:07 am

Zealadin wrote:
Stubborn also doesn't do anything towards shooting, you just ignore negative modifiers for morale tests.

That's what happens when you confuse Stubborn and Relentless...

Anyways, I agree that the lone Rhino/Razor won't stand a chance i hell to survive the game, but that is not the point, all it has to accomplice is to survive a full-pull and keep the Inq and Mystic alive until round two, where the Communion and DS magic starts to pop. I addition in a DS scenarion it will challenge your opponent, cause not only must he try to cancel out the sculls, but he also needs to take care of the Rhino racing down the opposite flank.
I know you said that the DS option was only that: an option. but WHEN you have paid the Inquisitor-toll, you can just as well pay the few extra credits to get maximum DS support. I would drop PsyCannon and termi-armor for Communion and a Mystic any day.

But, let us know what you end up with, and even more important - how did it fare.

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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by DonFer on Mon Apr 04, 2011 7:55 am

I'd not consider DS at all in this army since you'll be giving your opponent free KP. No unit has Heroic intervention, and there isn't enough Psycannon saturation to ensure a good shooting phase following a DS move (you'll have to DS all of the army in close proximity to put those 6 PsyC to use).

I agree about the PsyC/Inq/Mystic thing with Brother Slind, Inquisitors and PsyC are not worth it. As said before the GM is much better HQ choice (you get the psychic communion and the servo skulls too).


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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by Zealadin on Tue Apr 05, 2011 2:16 am

The GM is extremely expensive and the only thing he really adds is the d3 roll to give abilities. Probably the best of which is scout/counter attack. Communion is good but I don't really want to base an army around that since he has to start on the table to make it work, and Mordrak is a better choice for that route.

I chose the PsyAmmo over 2 PsyC for two reasons, points, and it makes them seem far less dangerous, both of which are good, and str 5 shooting is something that can wreak havoc against alot of opponents. They also will probably be used in some situations to screen the termies and give them a cover save.

I am still trying to figure out how to make a Termi concept work since I think this is too light on bodies.
I have another concept list I've looked at today that I'll post up when I get home.
Autocannon dreads are really tempting for ranged anti tank, but are susceptable to being taken out in a single shot.
DK are also expensive and I'm not sure whether to try and fit them or not at this point. Footslogging wise they add good targets that will possibly be perceived as dangerous.

The issue I have atm is I don't really see any of the GK HQ's as being worth their cost, or at the very least your paying for what you get, and its not really that unique. Even a Lib is extremely expensive, and a HQ is practically the cost of a whole squad of PAGK or GKT, and only a GM or Lib have something to really add, but its still a tradeoff.

Skulls are also great for stopping infiltrators and scouts, and can be used to force your opponents movement, which are useful, especially for only 9 points.

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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by Zealadin on Tue Apr 05, 2011 7:33 am

My newest concept list is as follows (its a bit over 1750, but still trying to figure out if its viable)

Keep in mind its footslogging and Terminator based.

OMI (3 Servo Skulls) 34
2* 5 Paladins (2 PsyC, 4 Halb/1DH) 315 (630)
2* 5 GKT (1 PsyC, 4 Halb/1 DH) 225 (450)
2*10 GKSS (2PsyC) 220 (440)
10 GKSS (PsyAmmo) 220

Now the IMO is basically a free kill, and the skulls might be useful for DS'ing, but I'm actually thinking they will be more of a psychological weapon. Your opponent knows they can move to within 6" and remove them from the game, which gives you a tactical advantage in trying to get your opponent to move units just to remove the skulls from play.

I could go with a GM basically for the cost of a GKSS squad, but scout might give me 6" extra movement for 1-3 units, and realistically I only need them to hit the 20-24 mark to really lay down the hurt, if someone can wipe them out from shooting that easily then I probably don't stand much of a chance regardless, and assault armies will have to come to me.

It has 10 Psycannons, 6 are relentless. One squad of GKSS with PsyAmmo just seemed nice for something different, plus I think the difference in strength will make a difference against some foes. Plus with this upgrade I can park them behind other units and not worry about rending shots being wasted by cover saves.

The main advantage is 50 bodies on the table. Particularly when they are all 2+ or 3+ and able to lay down 40 rending S7 shots a turn at 24".

I could look at incorporating a set of DK's in, or two TLPsyAutC Dreads, but DK's need swords to be really dangerous which means 310 points for two and the dreads are either 260 or 270 for two, and only provide S8 anti tank shots while providing my opponent somewhere to point their AT weapons.

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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by Rivan on Tue Apr 05, 2011 7:49 am

I like it for a footslogging theme. Fast, mobile armies can pose a problem though.

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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by DonFer on Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:05 am

Unless playing with Draigo, I'd recommend one Paladin Squad only, they're a huge point sink and not scoring. I'd also recommend only two SS. That's 535 pts to play with. Which in turn leaves you 30 bodies that can lay down a lot of hurt. You can include 2 NDK with Heavy Psycannon, a Purgation Squad or just pimp your units a little more. But that's just me.

I think this iteration is looking good. Let us know how it goes! Very Happy

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Re: 1750 Terminator Based List

Post by Zealadin on Wed Apr 06, 2011 5:52 am

The main reason I was tempted by the second Pally squad was the extra two relentless Pyscannons, but they are hideously expensive, and the loss of the DK's I think is noticeable.

Its a really hard balancing act.

The psycannons can negate some of the mobility issues as does the 24" Stormbolter range, but its always going to be a problem, particularly since I'm not taking any jump troops or DK with teleporters.

At the moment I am most tempted to add SR's, but that means totally changing the design. Plus I don't find GK dreads nearly as attractive as the blood talon BA versions which can rip through stuff.

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