OUR SUGGESTION FOR THE NEW DAEMONHUNTERS-GREY KNIGHTS CODEX

My recomendations:

Daemon terminology updated (daemons codex+ chaos SM DP+ Chaos Possessed Marines+ Defiler+ Avatar+ Necron gods, maybe even bearers of daemonic weapons, and Possessed vehicles of any sort)

I agree with the shrouding change of albedoc, not broken but not too powerfull

Aegis : either count the BC with a Psy Hood or give the unit 4+ save against Psy powers and perils of the warp, Psy hood on everyone can
be a bit overpower.

Rites: Units with "Daemon" rules get: Difficult terrain to assault, -1 ld in CC, Loose fearless in CC (so they can run and be wiped)
They can recycle as long as they are infantry, No units with models with more that 1 wound, fill a slot in the FOC.

New rule: Psy Charged attack=
Who has it?
NFW (all)
Psycannons
Psycannon bolts
Holocaust
hammerhand

Ruling: hits against units with "psyker" special rule, or that contains a Psyker or has an active Psy power
(even if you don't need to check Ld), those hits become "Rendring". Hits against a possessed vehicle (soulgrinder, defiler) or
Chaos LR with possesion upgrade gets an additional d6 for Armor Penetrating.


Explanation: WE ARE PSYKERS, each and everyone of us!! either great or not so great psykers but we are! so we have to know how to
kill psykers because they are the door for Daemonic possession. Also, the term "Psycannon" gets cooler.


Psy Powers:

Hammer hand: like albedoc is fine

Holocaust: 20 pts, str 5 ap 5 big blast auto hit (no longer +4 to hit). Ini 1 as a power fist (always last).

destroyer Daemon: as albedoc

Banishment: No idea since I placed a similar idea to albedoc on Rites, maybe when you use it, each unsaved wound counts as 2 for
resolution against units with "daemon" special rule.

Sanctuary: Same as albedoc

Scourging: Per word definition is "Punishment", since we already have enough anti troop shots I will go eldar on this one and maybe
make it like this: against units with "daemon" special rule, any failed To hit Roll in the shooting fase can be rerolled (2nd result stays)

Word of the emperor: Same with a small change, use the lowest Ld in the unit, of course Orks and Fearless will be safe, but it will
make the opponent sweat a bit.


That would be all for now, next I will focus on HQs

thanks gioz (BTW i'm ferdrig thordresson on GWtilea if you want to talk about it)!! i agree with you, but i must say that rending on a psicannon it's not so powerful, we need anti-tank weapons!! and GKs have only two special weapons, the incinerator should be anti-troops, psicannon anti-tanks/heavy infantry/monsters IMHO!!

thanks also to belissand!

Well, rending would be nice even against high armored infantry (as termy) but
- in 5th ed will be nerfed
- there are already SO many rending weapons
- it's not born to be an anti vehicle weapon
So why don't give psycannon another ability? Maybe with the 'great focus of holy might of super-uber psychic stream' you proposed in your previous post. This way the psycannon can change its profile to:
36" S6 VP4 heavy3 OR 36" S8 VP2 heavy1 twin-linked
(no more assaulty psycannon, I think, or it will have too much rules while GW is streamlining all 40k codexes)

Dreadnought should be heavy!

How else is i supposed too take my terminator squad, inquisitor with psycannon and eversor!

Psycannon same, it's good, cost less points or give a bonus when shooting daemons, +1 S or reroll to wound or something.

I missed a thing in my last post, the grand master of course have to make a psychic test too unleash the nemesis strike.

Psycannons have a recoil compensator and as such, SHOULD be assulty.

What do you think about my nemesis force weapon table?

You table is very nice, but the GM don't really need the extra 1 on str, str +2 is fine and make it a true "insta kill" is what I wanted to post on my next suggestion:

That means that no protection against insta kill works againts him.

Bye bye DP/ Greater Daemons/ Avatar/ and Nidz monstruous creatures.. and adamantium mantle, if he can get that upgrade then NO POINT COST REDUCTION!!! he will be very powerfull!!!

well, i think that your nemesis weapon table it's ok, i hate to see our brother captains so nerfed, they should be more powerful (maybe only the HQ, not the terminator's brother captain), and i agree with them making instant death (psichic test needed obviously...)!!

the grand master MUST be an instant killer, it's ridicolous that he can't kill instantly a daemon only because it's an "ethernal warrior"... pff!!

Yes, i think that too, and i just forgot too write the "after succesful psychic test" too make the nemesis strike.

And with str +3 you can go up too the soulgrinder!

OK, we can add the terminator justicar, as in the book grey knights the terminator squad is led by a justicar and not a brother captain.

Here goes.

Grey knight, justicar, terminator same.

Terminator justicar: +2 S PW: Yes Force: No
Brother captain: +2 S Pw: Yes Force: Yes (Normal)
Grand master: +3 S Pw: Yes Force: Yes (Special)

Brother captain and Terminator justicar: The terminator justicar will be the old brother captain, with +1 A from the normal termies, so the old brother captain will become Terminator justicar.

Brother captain will have 1 more wound and have a force weapon.
He will be a HQ choice.

The grand master will be a badass HQ choice with the special force weapon and so.
He will be 0-1.
___________________

The charged attack shouldn't be rending, it should be A) Reroll to hit/To wound/both.
B) A str bonus. C) ummmm, then i can't come up with anything else.

Maybe instead of the +3 to str, give him an extra 1d6 of AP, that way he will be like a Monstrous Creature against possessed vehicles without overpowering him against any other kind of troops.

Str 6 wounds on 4+ against: Greater Daemons, Nurgle Bikes, Wraith guard, Warboss on Bike, Carnifex, Avatar

difficult to wound on str6: Wraith Lord, Fex with To 7

Check my recommendation on "Psy Charged attack"

When i saw Aubérons cool conversions i got an idea.

New unit choice.

Tech-knight: Heavy support. (Maybe 0-1) xx Pts

The tech-knight surveys the machines the grey knights employ.
The tech-knight is armed with a gauntlet mounted storm bolter and a nemesis force weapon (power weapon with +2 S)
Has power armour and a servo harness (one power fist attack in cc)
He may be upgraded with:
Terminator armour XX Pts
Full servo harness XX Pts (re-roll repair roll or plus 1 to it)
Surveyor (or similar)XX Pts (Allows reroll to hit for all shooting weapons in the unit)
Maybe one can buy a +1 T body and a better inv save.
But inv saves are in armoury.

Retinue: The tech-knight may be accompanied with a retinue, if he does he looses indipendent character special rule until all other members in the unit is wiped out.
The retinue is bought from the purgation squad entry and the tech-knight replaces the justicar in the unit.

Tech-knight ws 5 bs 5 s 4 t 4 w 2 a 2 i 4 ld 10 sv 3+ Pts 60-70-ish

He had a chaplain too, i might work something up for that one too.

maybe after seeing the new SM codex we will get some nice stuff, like the thunderfire for Techmarine or a Master of the Forge of our own.

Personally a nice cheap choice to improve our elites (Termies) would be Psycannons bolts integrated to them and True grit.

Fast and Heavy are our weak spot, because we are not know for our Need for Speed.

If they dare moving our dreads from heavy to elite we will have too many elite choices and only LRs and Orbital as heavy...

It would be nice to hear some stuff on those subjects (units, tanks,etc..)

An other thing that has been running through my mind (painful OW!) is this:

Troop Choice:
PAGK= points as albedoc would be great (I can dream)
Justicar as albedoc suggested
Options:
the unit can take 2 Incinerators (10pts each) and/or psycannons (20-25 pts each).
(I obviously hope that by that time the Psycannon will be improved)

Speciality Purgator: a PAGK squad can take 2 additional Special weapons but counts as a Heavy Slot

Speciatily Teleporter: a PAGK squad can be deployed using "deep strike" and filling a Fast Slot

You may ask: Why? we already have the PAGK teleporting option and also PAGK as heavies?

Well with this we free up space on the heavy list giving some more space to whatever Mars forge will give us as a new heavy (the AV13 dread sounds good, 2 to go plz, make them with battle cannons).

Don't you mean mega psycannos?

S 7 Ap 2 Assult 5 Blast, Rng 35".
Hmmm, maybe too rippy...

Mega Psycannons? where did I say that? I just said Psycannons needed an improvement, I didn't mean going Imperial Armor on them. (but we can all wish ^_^)

I do believe we can get out AV13 dread @_@ (chaos has it, now vanilla marines, what about our BLING?)

You didn't say mega psycannons anywhere, but you said battlecannons.

And that is not something a grey knight would use!

Armour 13 dreads sounds like...... an....... idea....

Didn't come up with anything better too say.

I just used the battlecannon reference because that´s what the defiler uses and I think the Soulgrinder of chaos (av13) uses it (I think it has shorter range though).

A special kind of dreads is not really something we GK would use because we usualy get buried, but there should be an other nice propsal, or an improvement of the Orbital Strike (That would be Great!!!!)

An Ordnance blast weapons that deviates 2d6 and on hits it deviates half the number (or the lowest dice) and that you can point againts units not just scenary.

Yep, i mentioned some orbital strike ideas earlier in the tread.

Where is all the others who are supposed too come up with good ideas. (Ie, everyone else)